MSE News: Bank charges fighting on: a new legal argument

natweststaffmember

ProfessorX thank you for your post and I will post now and go back on one issue. Re the interest rate. You need to read the "grey list" in the 1993 EC Directive which specifically has a few things to say on financial institutions excluding unfair terms. Furthermore, I personally agree with you re a challenge on UTCCR 1999 reg 5(1) with referral to the ECJ based on the "grey list". The OFT have chosen NOT to do this which is disappointing in my opinion since it was in their POC originally, since banks failed to get a declaration on it in the court case and that this was a more stronger argument, imho.

kittiej

I too wonder how much the magic handshake was worth to protect the banks.

natweststaffmember

kittiej wrote: »

I too wonder how much the magic handshake was worth to protect the banks.

with all due respect, let's keep conspiracy theories off the thread when we are looking at what the decision was, how to move forwards and the way forward. It is very easy to say words when the judgement itself is what you need to read.

kittiej

OK so which is it?

Banks are truly out of pocket by people going OD and the £35 is the true and actual amount of the cost to them?

Or is it as they also claim an actual profit making side to banking bolstering supposedly free banking?

It can't be both.

I was supporting a view put over by ProfessorX actually.

natweststaffmember

I actually give in for the time being. I know I have better things to do with my time so have fun with the arguments.

BigBudgie

An excellent post Professor X.

I raised similar points on the Legal Beagles website in behind the scenes discussions.

You have articulated the points perfectly, would you mind if I extracted some of the points from your post and forward them to the OFT for their comments.

I was one of the Legal Beagles team who attended the Consumer Group meeting with the OFT in early December, we did raise the basic princiapls you have covered with them and hoped that it might influence their decision favourably. It obviousley didn't but it would be interesting to now get some feedback on these specific points.

Rgds Budgie

BOB_A_H

lincroft1710 wrote: »

Free banking usually means lending the bank money for virtually no interest and paying for extras you don't really need.

Exactly, once had a platinum or privelage or superior super duper account with LTSB. One day I get a letter TELLING me that they had "improved" my benefits. Cheaper car insurance although I do not drive. My golf clubs insured anywhere in the world although I do not play golf, great deals on wine that I do not drink etc, etc. I was charged £7 or so per month for this account.
Now before the predicted "why did you not change your account" questions come raining in, answer me this question first.......
Why did the bank not choose to find out if I actualy was a driver, played golf or drank wine? No, it is what suited THEM. There in lies the problem, I had no say or choice in the new "benefits", some arrogant, over payed jumped up executive thought they were smart enough to make this decision on my behalf.
So the weary "you signed a contract that charges were a part of the T&C's" brigade" Answer me why I was paying for what was some other persons hobbies and pastimes. I signed no contract agreeing to this nonsense, yet still it happened.

LizzieS_2

BOB_A_H wrote: »

lincroft1710 wrote: »

Free banking usually means lending the bank money for virtually no interest and paying for extras you don't really need.

Exactly, once had a platinum or privelage or superior super duper account with LTSB. One day I get a letter TELLING me that they had "improved" my benefits. Cheaper car insurance although I do not drive. My golf clubs insured anywhere in the world although I do not play golf, great deals on wine that I do not drink etc, etc. I was charged £7 or so per month for this account.
Now before the predicted "why did you not change your account" questions come raining in, answer me this question first.......
Why did the bank not choose to find out if I actualy was a driver, played golf or drank wine? No, it is what suited THEM. There in lies the problem, I had no say or choice in the new "benefits", some arrogant, over payed jumped up executive thought they were smart enough to make this decision on my behalf.
So the weary "you signed a contract that charges were a part of the T&C's" brigade" Answer me why I was paying for what was some other persons hobbies and pastimes. I signed no contract agreeing to this nonsense, yet still it happened.

Why choose a fee paying account?

Why the need for some executively worded account instead of a normal bank account that gives you the same DDs etc?

The account name alone suggests it was tailored for the upper crusts who would pay to flash their super duper card in public and would use the services provided. The banks are intelligent enough to realise that there are plenty of Mrs Bouquets around who would not take up the freebies, but just preferred to look to the rest of the world as being superior.

In answer to your question, you simply chose an account that did not fit your lifestyle, so was a bad choice by you.

natweststaffmember

LizzieS wrote: »

BOB_A_H wrote: »

Why choose a fee paying account?

Why the need for some executively worded account instead of a normal bank account that gives you the same DDs etc?

The account name alone suggests it was tailored for the upper crusts who would pay to flash their super duper card in public and would use the services provided. The banks are intelligent enough to realise that there are plenty of Mrs Bouquets around who would not take up the freebies, but just preferred to look to the rest of the world as being superior.

In answer to your question, you simply chose an account that did not fit your lifestyle, so was a bad choice by you.

To clarify, a lot of packaged accounts early on were blatantly missold. I will give you some live examples; I'll send some more information out to you--that meant convert the account without consent. A manager ordering that accounts be converted and that customer be contacted the day after because then the points for having reached their branch target would give them a bonus. Let's fast forward a few years in further, convert your account and in three months you'll get a better card. Convert your account and you'll get a cheaper loan when the cost of the account minus the saving still does not make sense. Let's fast forward even further forward, our best account is this one---especially to people from overseas since they may well already be used to paying for an account. What was the real reason for selling these accounts with extras? Simple, Branch bonuses and money £££££.
Has the culture of selling changed? never in a billion years.

As to why someone took the account out in the first place....it's called TRUST, we used to and some still do TRUST that the local branch people have OUR needs at the forefront of their minds and not the pressure to hit targets for packaged accounts, credit cards and the like. Awful as this is to say, but foolish thinking.

[Deleted User]

On the topic of mis-selling, I was offered and given a Barclays Premier account and advised I'd receive the new black debit/cheque guarantee card and it would allow me to withdraw more money from cash machines per day but this card never arrived, I rang countless times and called into the same branch that sold me the account and after around 10 conversations I was told I couldn't have this card... at the time I said this represented a mis-sell and demanded all monthly charges for the account back but this fell on deaf ears... Looking back on it can I take this claim further as those monthly account fees will add up nicely now.

The reason I took the account was they advised it provided an interest free overdraft upto £1000 and since I live in this most of the time it would cost roughly the same as what my interest charges were on my current overdraft (which was first £500 free) plus I'd have the added benefits of which I only use the free mobile insurance.