Rent Admin Fee

mynameisdave

axomoxia wrote: »

So, the landlord does not pay anything then?

A LL pays the letting agent to find a tenant for their property. If half arsed people waste their time viewing properties and taking nice glossies from the office when they have little intention of ever viewing the property who pays for this?

These are associated costs of running their business. They are entitled to charge for them. Pass all these costs on to the LL and the LL Will take their business elsewhere.

In regard to agencies charging upfront fees? I've seen jobs advertised where the applicant has to pay for the CRB upfront. I excercised my right to go elsewhere rather than apply at my own expense.A prospective tenant has the freedom to go elsewhere and find a cheaper option, or has been suggested go private.

axomoxia

mynameisdave wrote: »

A LL pays the letting agent to find a tenant for their property. If half arsed people waste their time viewing properties and taking nice glossies from the office when they have little intention of ever viewing the property who pays for this?.

The Landlord. Or as when I sold my house, I did. Are you suggesting that letting agents charge for a brochure? Perhaps a money slot on the door, like the toilets at Waterloo station?

Anyhow, my guess about agencies using tenant "admin charges" to fund lower landlord cost as mean of grabbing the landlord business appears to be the case. Sounds like implementing the scottish law on tenant charges for the rest of the uk should level the playing fields a bit.

I wonder what proportion of lettings are advertised via agency?

tbs624

mynameisdave wrote: »

A LL pays the letting agent to find a tenant for their property. If half arsed people waste their time viewing properties and taking nice glossies from the office when they have little intention of ever viewing the property who pays for this?

Let's be honest, if LAs did a decent job, and the properties were all in good condition and accurately described, then maybe there'd be less time-wasting all round. Many Ts can tell tales of LAs who are rude to potential Ts, LAs who don't turn up at a property, or who do turn up but without the keys, who can't answer even the most basic question on the property or provide gas safety certs, EPCs, evidence of LLs BTL or CTL status etc.

mynameisdave wrote: »

These are associated costs of running their business. They are entitled to charge for them. Pass all these costs on to the LL and the LL Will take their business elsewhere.

The analogy with selling a house holds good - lots of people take "glossies" and go to viewings that don't result in a sale but its the vendor who foots the bill. The very fact that LLs are operating a business means its even more appropriate that LLs foot their own bill if they choose to contract an LA because, as I have already said, LLs can set such fees down on their tax returns.

tbs624

neiljscampbell wrote: »

....Previous posts talked about regulations in the UK being un-enforceable but this seems pretty concrete - at least in Scotland...

Neil

It's not so much that what's there is unenforceable, more that the law hasn't been updated to cover the money-grabbing antics of today's generation of letting agencies. The law is the Accommodation Agencies Act 1953, which was supposed to be a temporary piece of legislation but was made permanent under the Expiring Laws Act 1969 . JoWo described it as "elderly law", a description usually reserved for much older statutes, but I'd agree with her that its provisions are out of step with current LA practices.

The quotes you have posted up from Scottish Law are far more in line with what should be in place across the country. As these charges from LAs seem to be increasing, Ts should be joining forces with one another and campaigning long and hard to highlight the issue and seek relevant changes to the law.

landscaperico

So how can we protest to the charges who do can we write a letter of complaint too?

I just looked at another property yesterday and asked for the admin fees this time it was £160 each, crazy, £320 all together and that for me ruled the property out straight away, more so for the principle than the money, I'm just sick of it, for anyone wondering I'm staying put, and writing a letter to watchdog regarding all of these things, who knows it may go somewhere!

Jowo_2

landscaperico wrote: »

So how can we protest to the charges who do can we write a letter of complaint too?

I just looked at another property yesterday and asked for the admin fees this time it was £160 each, crazy, £320 all together and that for me ruled the property out straight away, more so for the principle than the money, I'm just sick of it, for anyone wondering I'm staying put, and writing a letter to watchdog regarding all of these things, who knows it may go somewhere!

No-one. It's a free market and the fees are legal. Agents can charge what they please, whatever the market rate is, and its up to customers to accept this or take their business elsewhere. Virtually all agents charge tenants fees to process their tenancy and its all legit, if deeply unpopular, particularly as they reap charges from both tenant and landlord as intermediaries for both.

landscaperico

I know its a free market and the fees are legal but even so that dosnt make it right like we've said in previous posts if its illegal to do the same thing in other sectors why is it legal to do it in this sector, yes it may currently be legal but there is no reason why raising this issue with the right people in the right places cant make it illegal. Free markets have rules too, just because its free doesnt mean it shouldn't be regulated!!

I'm that peed off with this that I'm going to do everything I can to solve this issue. If anyone has any suggestions how, I'd appreciate them!!

Jowo_2

You could raise it with your local MP. Your alternative in the near future is to find a private landlord, negotiate a lower price with an agent (possible) or find one that doesn't charge tenants (rare).

Its perfectly legal for businesses to charge customers for their services - virtually all do, with the exception of charities and not-for-profit organisations. The admin fees agents charge are extremely unpopular, some might say unethical, but are legit and are the norm. A sense of outrage because the fees don't seem to reflect the work involved is insufficient, in my opinion.

If a website designer charges £150 for a website, it's pointless to ignore their experience, their need to make a living, their expensive PC/software and offer them £20 on the basis that 'you only took a few hours to do it and you reworked an existing template'. There's no ombudsman to deal with this grevious exploitation - the customer who wants a website can either shop around or make do with a spotty teenager to do it for beer money.

axomoxia

Jowo wrote: »

You could raise it with your local MP. Your alternative in the near future is to find a private landlord, negotiate a lower price with an agent (possible) or find one that doesn't charge tenants (rare).

Tricky, due to the large proportion of rented property available solely through agents.

Jowo wrote: »

Its perfectly legal for businesses to charge customers for their services - virtually all do, with the exception of charities and not-for-profit organisations. The admin fees agents charge are extremely unpopular, some might say unethical, but are legit and are the norm. A sense of outrage because the fees don't seem to reflect the work involved is insufficient, in my opinion.

Except you are not doing work for the tenant, you are doing the work that the landlord has contracted (and is paying) you to do - to whit, to find suitable tenants. Are you saying you are acting as agents for the tenants as well as the landlord?

Jowo wrote: »

If a website designer charges £150 for a website, it's pointless to ignore their experience, their need to make a living, their expensive PC/software and offer them £20 on the basis that 'you only took a few hours to do it and you reworked an existing template'. There's no ombudsman to deal with this grevious exploitation - the customer who wants a website can either shop around or make do with a spotty teenager to do it for beer money.

Very bad analogy this one, there are only two parties in the agreement - the customer and the designer. Where is the agent in this scenario?

Jowo_2

axomoxia wrote: »

Very bad analogy this one, there are only two parties in the agreement - the customer and the designer. Where is the agent in this scenario?

Rejecting the cost of a website design because the designer hasn't spent much time or expenditure on it is a good analogy.

Remember the OPs original post was about how he demanded an itemised bill from the agent for their services, believing the agents time spent on the matter should not be included in the fee and complaining that 'they are telling me that they want me to pay for advertising.' A lot of the negative posts about agents complain that the time/effort/expense expended by the agent isn't representative of the costs they charge the tenant.

The costs charged to the customer by the agent are not representative of the expense incurred and nor are mine when I bill my clients directly - that's how the market works.

Another example is that I recently paid a plumbing company £2500 for one days work to replace my boiler, of which £1000 was the actual hardware costs involved. Granted that the plumber is skilled but I spent the equivalent of paying the company £250 per hour for his time, plus they get to sell my old boiler parts that they took away.

Where do I complain about this outrageous charge which didn't reflect the time and effort spent by the plumber who probably only got paid £40 per hour by his company?

Oh, I can't complain - it's a free market based on supply and demand. I could either choose to freeze all winter with no hot water or pay whatever plumbers can get away with charging. As there are lots of customers, the ball is in their court.

Another example cited is recruitment agents - they only charge the employer, not the temp. But wait a minute, they take a percentage of everything paid to the temp for the entire length of the contract. And yet all they've done is stuck an advert on the website, sent a couple of CVs through to the client and signed a couple of photocopied contracts. Outrageous that they may reap hundreds or thousands of pounds for work someone else is doing when they've only spent a few hours setting it up! Who do I complain to?