B+Q/Wickes etc Double Glazing

wallbash

You would disagree. You live in a modern house that most likely got thrown up in a few months

Don't know many houses built ever that took more than few weeks. Even back in the
13th Century houses were built ( or thrown up ) :rolleyes: at a reasonable rate of time.

horror stories with new build believe me

Would not argue , but won't tar all new builds without more info.

Some people use a house as a means to live. Others like me see the house as thier home.

Another very wild assumption without proof.

As I stated ( with photo's in another thread) have installed Hardwood windows
which in the correct place looked great, but required maintenance .


Finally

You are from the disposable age

And you are not living today!!


PS check out some old photos I uploaded recently
to First time renovation.

chrisg1985

wallbash wrote: »

Don't know many houses built ever that took more than few weeks. Even back in the
13th Century houses were built ( or thrown up ) :rolleyes: at a reasonable rate of time.




Would not argue , but won't tar all new builds without more info.




Another very wild assumption without proof.

As I stated ( with photo's in another thread) have installed Hardwood windows
which in the correct place looked great, but required maintenance .


Finally




And you are not living today!!


PS check out some old photos I uploaded recently
to First time renovation.

'If I ever bought a new house which won't happen ( I know some real horror stories with new build believe me ) I would have ally powdercoat windows . They look good and really do last.'

If you want to debate windows or anything for that matter relating to restoration please quote me right. Some means not all and I do have info that would make your eyes water actually but best left alone.Unless you press me again and I will reveal some vile new build 'stories' as I am sure you would like to call them

wallbash wrote: »

Don't know many houses built ever that took more than few weeks. Even back in the
13th Century houses were built ( or thrown up ) :rolleyes: at a reasonable rate of time.

Run of the mill stuff took weeks. Houses still standing from this period are usually of exceptionally high quality.

Great houses take time to build. My fireplace can spit roast half a cow. Houses like this were built to last and did not take 'weeks'.

New build is thrown up. Sadly it's just not economical to produce quality these days. Although that said in my line I refuse to do anything other than quality as it's always more economical in the long run.

Quote:
You are from the disposable age

And you are not living today!!

I am but you see when there is an opportunity to do something right I will take it. No doubt costs me more money, time and effort. In the end this proves far more economical and sustainable.

Another very wild assumption without proof.

As I stated ( with photo's in another thread) have installed Hardwood windows
which in the correct place looked great, but required maintenance .

Refering to your earlier post I would say anyone calling someone a 'snob' for advocating the right sustainable methods is unreasonable.

This would always be a clash of opinions. One side you have me restoring and enjoying traditional qualities. You enjoying tidy square new build. As you will note I do agree with windows that are not timber. There has to be atleast a good point to having them in my opinion.

Cheers. :beer:

27col

I agree entirely with wallbash. All spec built houses are thrown up to some degree and probably always have been. The quicker they are built, the quicker the builder and speculator get their money. Modern ones at least have a good foundation and proper lintels, which more than can be said for a lot of Georgian and Victorian houses. Builders were almost by definition related to cowboys. They were speculators and nothing else. Not that I have any objection to speculation. people have a right to earn their money where they can. 13th century farm houses are all very well, but hardly typical. In any event they are as likely to fall down due to disrepair as any other. All houses require maintenance at regular intervals, whether they are 50 years old or 600.They certainly were not built to any standard other than "rule of thumb" and what the builder could get away with. Chrisg1985 comes over as a bit of smug, self satisfied type who thinks that he knows something the rest of us can only guess about.

wallbash

Would be interested in how long a 13th century farm houses took to build .


No water / plumbing / electric /insulation ( walls plastered??)
So we are talking a 'box' with windows and doors

I bet supplying the materials, that were not actually local would be difficult
But houses were normally built with local stuff.
Also had idea that the mortar used was best layed in the warmer weather??
And we are talking Farm house not Church/ castle :rotfl:

I think we are all getting off topic . will agree with a lot of your posting
but will still defend modern products correctly used in the right environment.

chrisg1985

wallbash wrote: »

Would be interested in how long a 13th century farm houses took to build .


No water / plumbing / electric /insulation ( walls plastered??)
So we are talking a 'box' with windows and doors

I bet supplying the materials, that were not actually local would be difficult
But houses were normally built with local stuff.
Also had idea that the mortar used was best layed in the warmer weather??
And we are talking Farm house not Church/ castle :rotfl:

I think we are all getting off topic . will agree with a lot of your posting
but will still defend modern products correctly used in the right environment.

No water / plumbing / electric /insulation ( walls plastered??)
So we are talking a 'box' with windows and doors

Yeh sure we are getting off topic, the building was built for a lord in this area.It's fair to say it was not a a box. He is believed to of owned most of our local area at one point.

And we are talking Farm house not Church/ castle :rotfl:

They are really the only properties built well enough to be standing useable 600 + years on.

wallbash wrote: »

Would be interested in how long a 13th century farm houses took to build .

Would not even want to think of the effort that went into lifting an oak beam 50-60ft long thats the best part of 2ft square in those days.

I bet supplying the materials, that were not actually local would be difficult

Interesting point that. I wouldnt mind knowing where the brick came from. I might look into that.

chrisg1985

27col wrote: »

I agree entirely with wallbash. All spec built houses are thrown up to some degree and probably always have been. The quicker they are built, the quicker the builder and speculator get their money. Modern ones at least have a good foundation and proper lintels, which more than can be said for a lot of Georgian and Victorian houses. Builders were almost by definition related to cowboys. They were speculators and nothing else. Not that I have any objection to speculation. people have a right to earn their money where they can. 13th century farm houses are all very well, but hardly typical. In any event they are as likely to fall down due to disrepair as any other. All houses require maintenance at regular intervals, whether they are 50 years old or 600.They certainly were not built to any standard other than "rule of thumb" and what the builder could get away with. Chrisg1985 comes over as a bit of smug, self satisfied type who thinks that he knows something the rest of us can only guess about.

A few things to note:

- brick arched lintels are some of the finest engineering.

- Building on 4ft of sand does not hurt anyone especially when you have all your neighbours to hold you up!

-foundations are all well and good but sadly quality of materials available now economically anyway are not a patch on what they used to be.

Chrisg1985 comes over as a bit of smug, self satisfied type who thinks that he knows something the rest of us can only guess about.[/QUOTE]

Unless you have been on a few new build projects and actually worked with the lads house bashing as its known in the trade you will never know. If you had you would not of made that comment above.

13th century farm houses are all very well, but hardly typical.

The whole debate was old vs new. He is using his house/s in debate as I use mine.

27col wrote: »

I agree entirely with wallbash. All spec built houses are thrown up to some degree and probably always have been.

How open ended is this? A good chunk of Victorian properties were built with craftmanship that is all but dead now. Skills that are becoming fewer and further between. Have you ever walked into period unabused lounge and looked up col?

I could spend all day tearing your comments apart but i have not got all day

andrew-b

What has any of this got to do with the OPs questions?

There is no debate..the OP is on a budget. uPVC windows suit there requirements. You appear to merely be trying to promote your own trade. Have you even asked what the OP is looking for?
In case you hadn't noticed this is a money saving forum...not a forum on the renovation of period properties where timber windows are more suited!

Back to the topic:
To the OP... if you have someone install windows then you should be looking for membership of FENSA or CertAs..the former being the more widely known ..the latter increasingly common. If they don't belong to these two bodies ..or indeed if you fancy diying it then you would need to go via local building control office in order to comply with regulations. There will be a charge for that but not a huge amount i believe.

Replacing windows isn't rocket science...if you can use a drill, a screwdriver and a sealant gun you have the necessary skills! Obviously you don't have as much experience as someone fitting windows everyday and it will take you somewhat longer. Summer would be a better time to be doing this though when there are more daylight hours and better weather. Even a novice should easily be able to replace at least one window in day!

Incidentally i think you can also order made to measure windows from Wickes if there standard sizes are unsuited.

andrew-b

BTW, someone mentioned insurance backed guarantees...any company registered with FENSA or CertAs is required to provide such a guarantee.

27col

In answer to your question, yes I have walked into an unabused Victorian house and looked up. I am not arguing about decorative plasterwork in Victorian houses. It was purely decorative and none the worst for that. Not much call for it today, except to renovate old buildings. There was nothing special about the actual structure.
I agree, the old skills should be retained. In fact I love to see old building re-used. The old spec builders tarted the basic houses up with decorative plasterwork and factory-made cast iron mouldings.
I for one would rather have a decent foundation than rely on adjacent houses to help keep mine up.
Actually I have been involved in two of my own self builds and several other projects with other people. Also some years in building maintenance, so I do have a reasonable idea of domestic dwelling construction.. Obviously arched brick lintels are good but I have worked in older houses that had a bit of rotten 4 x 2 as a lintel. As to your ideas about modern materials for foundations I don't think so.
Anyway it is probably best that we agree to disagree. We obviously have very different ideas about building in general.

leveller2911

Just my penneth worth : Ive worked on 13th Century farm houses,Castles,Churches, Georgian houses,Victorian and modern houses and I would say "Cowboy builders " have been busy through history and are part of our Great Colourful History.Quality of materials have always been an issue too..You can't compare apples and pears....

There are pro,s and cons for both sides of the arguement here ,which I'm not getting involved in........I make bespoke Joinery and my heart sinks when I see a nice Georgian or Victorian House which has had the Boxframe windows replaced with Upvc , but there are substancial cost implications which I do understand......A fair bit of my work now is taking our these Upvc windows and putting back nice hardwood Boxframes , so times and tastes are changing for the better.

Cheers all, lets have a big manly hug ,shout FUBAR and crack open a bottle....Pub anyone???:D