Free solar power system. Is it a scam?

Energy_Saving_Trust_company_representative

As our name has cropped up in this thread several times it has pinged up on our radar, and as one of the EST's experts I have been asked to post a comment.

Rent a roof does seem to raise strong emotions. I know a number of our Regional Microgeneration Advice Coordinators (one in each advice centre) have been upset by early market rent a roof companies 'trying it on' with contracts that were very biased. Some even proposed selling the household the solar electricity as well them taking the FIT, but I'm glad to say this is not the norm and the practicalities of metering and billing will probably mean it will never happen.

However the market does now seem to be settling down as what to expect becomes more widely known. Our advice coordinators have been watching this closely and can now provide lots on help on what to expect in a contract.

I haven't read through all 49 pages of this thread, so excuse me if this is covered elsewhere but...

The best way to take advantage of the FIT is always to pay for your panels yourself - Cash. That way you will recieve all the FIT.

The second best way is to take out a loan to pay for the panels. That way you recieve the whole FIT but will have to pay some away in interest to a finacial institution. However you should still make a tidy profit. See our FIT calculator investment tool for a basic view of this.

Finally, if you can't raise the loan, or don't want to exhaust your credit limit, you can rent your roof.

Crudely, for rent your roof, the most practical arrangement is the company/person that owns the panels will recieve the generation tariff, i.e. 41p (existing property) for every kWhr the array generates. This is easy to administer as it is the reading on the Total Genration meter that has to be fitted between the array's inverter and the point where it joins the household circuits. It is also the reading the energy supplier and Ofgem will be asking for in order to credit the FIT to someone.

Now some companies also want the export tariff, but this gets complicated. The industry standard assumption is that this is 50% of the total generation. This is no doubt wrong in both directions, but until we all get smart meters, and since the difference is only a few £10s it is not worth worrying about too much.

Now Rent your roof does mean there will be restrictions in what you can then do with your roof as the investor will want to protect their investment for the contract period. So if you think you might want to build a roof extention, or even re roof, or that subsequent owners might want to do these, make sure you check the contract to see what escape clauses you would have. A good contract would allow you to buy your way out, though this would probably be punitive, just like early redemption of a mortgage.

The best advice I can give for rent your roofers is, think agricultural. You have the acreage and you are renting your roof to someone to sow a valuable crop. They can't do this without you - make sure you charge a good rent.

As for making use of the 'free' electricity - If you are clever, or can set up your house to be clever (see our blog for more on this), you can make sure that you try to do your washing/oven cooking/water heating when the sun is shining and avoid electricity consumption at night. This way you might consume more than 50% of the total generation and save further on your electricty (import) bills.

I hope this helps. Please be gentle with me!

RacyRed

Energy_Saving_Trust_company_representative wrote: »

As our name has cropped up in this thread several times it has pinged up on our radar, and as one of the EST's experts I have been asked to post a comment.

Rent a roof does seem to raise strong emotions. I know a number of our Regional Microgeneration Advice Coordinators (one in each advice centre) have been upset by early market rent a roof companies 'trying it on' with contracts that were very biased. Some even proposed selling the household the solar electricity as well them taking the FIT, but I'm glad to say this is not the norm and the practicalities of metering and billing will probably mean it will never happen.

However the market does now seem to be settling down as what to expect becomes more widely known. Our advice coordinators have been watching this closely and can now provide lots on help on what to expect in a contract.

I haven't read through all 49 pages of this thread, so excuse me if this is covered elsewhere but...

The best way to take advantage of the FIT is always to pay for your panels yourself - Cash. That way you will recieve all the FIT.

The second best way is to take out a loan to pay for the panels. That way you recieve the whole FIT but will have to pay some away in interest to a finacial institution. However you should still make a tidy profit. See our FIT calculator investment tool for a basic view of this.

Finally, if you can't raise the loan, or don't want to exhaust your credit limit, you can rent your roof.

Crudely, for rent your roof, the most practical arrangement is the company/person that owns the panels will recieve the generation tariff, i.e. 41p (existing property) for every kWhr the array generates. This is easy to administer as it is the reading on the Total Genration meter that has to be fitted between the array's inverter and the point where it joins the household circuits. It is also the reading the energy supplier and Ofgem will be asking for in order to credit the FIT to someone.

Now some companies also want the export tariff, but this gets complicated. The industry standard assumption is that this is 50% of the total generation. This is no doubt wrong in both directions, but until we all get smart meters, and since the difference is only a few £10s it is not worth worrying about too much.

Now Rent your roof does mean there will be restrictions in what you can then do with your roof as the investor will want to protect their investment for the contract period. So if you think you might want to build a roof extention, or even re roof, or that subsequent owners might want to do these, make sure you check the contract to see what escape clauses you would have. A good contract would allow you to buy your way out, though this would probably be punitive, just like early redemption of a mortgage.

The best advice I can give for rent your roofers is, think agricultural. You have the acreage and you are renting your roof to someone to sow a valuable crop. They can't do this without you - make sure you charge a good rent.

As for making use of the 'free' electricity - If you are clever, or can set up your house to be clever (see our blog for more on this), you can make sure that you try to do your washing/oven cooking/water heating when the sun is shining and avoid electricity consumption at night. This way you might consume more than 50% of the total generation and save further on your electricty (import) bills.

I hope this helps. Please be gentle with me!

Some sensible advice at last. Thank you.

Froggitt

Energy_Saving_Trust_company_representative wrote: »

See our FIT calculator investment tool for a basic view of this.

This one? http://www.energysavingtrust.org.uk/Generate-your-own-energy/Cashback-Calculator

Too many questions that only an expert would know the answer to therefore no help at all.

XRayDave

Froggitt wrote: »

This one? http://www.energysavingtrust.org.uk/Generate-your-own-energy/Cashback-Calculator

Too many questions that only an expert would know the answer to therefore no help at all.

I felt that it was straight-forward to use. As I had previously thought, the payback period would be in the region 12-15 years (a figure that has been confirmed/discussed several times recently).

rgds

XRD

Froggitt

Size category of installation

4kW existing build
4kW new build
4-10kW
10-100kW
100kW-5MW


Also....... Size - enter system size kWp


Mmmmmm - very straight forward.

Gizmosmum_2

Froggitt wrote: »

Size category of installation

4kW existing build
4kW new build
4-10kW
10-100kW
100kW-5MW


Also....... Size - enter system size kWp


Mmmmmm - very straight forward.

Hi Froggitt

It's all a bit like learning a foreign language - if you call your local Energy Saving Trust Advice Centre on 0800 512 012 they'll translate for you

keith_r59

XRayDave wrote: »

I felt that it was straight-forward to use. As I had previously thought, the payback period would be in the region 12-15 years (a figure that has been confirmed/discussed several times recently).

rgds

XRD

I found that the EST calculator makes far too many assumptions that you can't change e.g. roof pitch, roof orientation, where you live etc.

Try using this one:

http://www.solarguide.co.uk/solar-pv-calculator?sc_formtype=3#factors

Calculations for my own system indicate payback in 10-11 years.

Zenoka

keith_r59 wrote: »

I found that the EST calculator makes far too many assumptions that you can't change e.g. roof pitch, roof orientation, where you live etc.

Try using this one:

http://www.solarguide.co.uk/solar-pv-calculator?sc_formtype=3#factors

Calculations for my own system indicate payback in 10-11 years.

I've just put our details into that calculator, some of the figures are a bit scary!

Is electricity really going to cost £1.09 per unit in 25 years? That will mean our bill will be around £5,000 a year!:eek::eek::eek:

It also uses 13.9 per unit for this year, isn't that a bit high? We pay less than that and I've heard some people with Ovo? are only paying around 7p a unit?

I find it most shocking how fast they predict prices are going up! I wish DH wages would go up that fast

karren

I applied for ht ebritish gas scheme for the school and the council came back and said it wasnt an economical choice so not sure that its as straightforward as made out which was disapointing to say the least.

keith_r59

Zenoka wrote: »

I've just put our details into that calculator, some of the figures are a bit scary!

Is electricity really going to cost £1.09 per unit in 25 years? That will mean our bill will be around £5,000 a year!:eek::eek::eek:

It also uses 13.9 per unit for this year, isn't that a bit high? We pay less than that and I've heard some people with Ovo? are only paying around 7p a unit?

I find it most shocking how fast they predict prices are going up! I wish DH wages would go up that fast

You can change all those details under the assumptions section to make it more accurate for your own personal circumstances.