Free solar power system. Is it a scam?

Jon_Tiffany

joolsleeds wrote: »

Cardew/Others...

Can I please check if you think my method of calculating energy harvested off the roof is correct as per my previous post?

As mentioned, my Owl meter measures the total consumption within the house and my electricity meter measures the electricity charged. I have tested that the Owl is not measuring the net consumption, by observing the consumption when the electric shower is running, during the day, and at night, with the owl showing ~8.5 irrespective of day or night (assuming that's the only appliance running)

I there for deduct the meter reading from the owl reading, and that's what I've saved.

I know that the Owl is probably not all that accurate, but good enough for a guide, I would have thought?

Thanks

Almost correct - deducting the meter reading from the owl reading will give you the export amount.

The Owl monitor can not tell the difference between import and export, so the figure shown on the Owl is import + export.

So we know the following:

Generated - as shown on the inverter - E.g. 5 units
Imported - as shown on the electric meter E.g. 8 Units
Import + Export - as shown on the Owl E.g 10 Units

So for the above, of the 5 generated units, 3 would have been used in the house and 2 exported.

Jon_Tiffany

Cardew wrote: »

I really don't know how the ASG system is wired, so can't comment.

However even if it is a valid form of measurement, it is still very much 'wet finger' in the air as you are basing everything on the fact that you 'normally use 12 kWh' in a day.

If your meter 'moves by 7 kWh' your assumption that the panels are providing 5 kWh might well be the case, although the Owl type meters are notoriously inaccurate at low consumption.

The other factor is that your 3.3 kWp system will produce around 3kW on a sunny late June day around noon. A day later, if cloudy, it could well be 1kW.

I read earlier in this thread that ASG will show you how to connect your Owl to their installation to monitor the exported electricity. So knowing how much electricity has been generated, and how much exported, you can calculate how much has been used in the house. e.g. 400 kWh generated and 300 kWh exported in a month means 100 kWh used in the house.

There an exchange of posts earlier in this thread with ASG where I surmised that I thought people would do well if they used 1,000 kWh pa with the ASG system, and that figure wasn't disputed.

Cardew, it is not possible to connect the Owl monitor to monitor the export. It can either read your import + export when attached to your electric meter, or can read the output from your panels.

I dont see the inaccuracy of the Owl at low consumption as an issue for this purpose.

Cardew

Jon_Tiffany wrote: »

Almost correct - deducting the meter reading from the owl reading will give you the export amount.

The Owl monitor can not tell the difference between import and export, so the figure shown on the Owl is import + export.

So we know the following:

Generated - as shown on the inverter - E.g. 5 units
Imported - as shown on the electric meter E.g. 8 Units
Import + Export - as shown on the Owl E.g 10 Units

So for the above, of the 5 generated units, 3 would have been used in the house and 2 exported.

I thought that with the ASG system there isn't an meter(available for the householder) on the inverter output?

So for your method you would need two Owl meters?

noncom_2

See here:

http://www.diykyoto.com/store/assets/0000/0414/Holmes_Renewable_Manual__V0.4_.pdf

The minor change to the wiring mentioned under "Ideal Installation" will allow you to measure (using two separate monitors, or the Wattson it is written for):

Instantaneous Generation
Instantaneous House Consumption.

From which you can then work out Instantaneous Import and Export:

Generation - Consumption = Export (or if the number is negative, Import)

The advantage to this is that if you use data logging monitors, you can then build up a proper day/time pattern of what you are generating, consuming and exporting to allow you to adjust your usage most effectively.

I don't know if ASG would allow you to make this modification though. The company that is doing my own private installation in a few weeks has agreed to do so.

Jon_Tiffany

Cardew wrote: »

I thought that with the ASG system there isn't an meter(available for the householder) on the inverter output?

So for your method you would need two Owl meters?

There has to be an Ofgem approved generation meter, you can take the reading from that if the inverter doesnt have a display.

Cardew

Jon_Tiffany wrote: »

There has to be an Ofgem approved generation meter, you can take the reading from that if the inverter doesnt have a display.

As I understand it from these quotes, the ASG meter does not display the cumulative output in kWh.

Had the PV system from ASG fitted last week. 18 panels on a South-facing roof.


the meter that A Shade Greener (ASG) put in to monitor the output of the panels (referred to as a "Generation Meter") has a built-in GSM mobile phone connection. When they commission your system, they pop a SIM card into the meter and voila - they get daily reports of how the PV system is performing.

The readings on the meter's display are, however, incomprehensible. Hence my purchase of an Efergy Elite Energy Monitor to see how the panels are performing.

The Generation Meter is a Iskra Emeco ME372 (see this URL): h ttp://w ww.iskranet.co.uk /index.php?cat=Iskra_Emeco_Electricity_Meters

This from ASG:

Lostrider - as regards monitoring the output. We don't just intend to send a report, according to my records (if you are who I think you are) you should have received an email from me explaining that there will be an 'app' on our website soon where those who have their system installed will be able to monitor what is being produced by their system. This will be exactly the information we have. You can also buy an energy meter at very little cost from most major DIY stores and if the cuff is placed correctly this will show you realtime. If you buy one, I will arrange for an electrician to fit it. In fact, give me a ring and I will buy it for you!


X-Ray Dave - we're hoping to have an application on our website that will enable each homeowner to click through to read their own meter - i.e. the cumulative produced. At the moment, however, it's not looking that simple. I'm no IT person so I can't say why but apparently it's not as easy as we thought it would be - will keep homeowners updated. In the meantime there are a couple of homeowners I email each Friday with their cumulative kwh readings. If you want me to email you, just drop me a line (but I can't do it for everyone otherwise I would soon be spending all day Friday emailing)

Sarah Dyson - A Shade Greener.

Jon_Tiffany

Cardew wrote: »

As I understand it from these quotes, the ASG meter does not display the cumulative output in kWh.

This from ASG:

I would be amazed if an ofgem approved electricity meter didn't display the cumulative output in kWh.

I have an Iskra ME162 meter and it displays the total kWh.

Cardew

Jon_Tiffany wrote: »

I would be amazed if an ofgem approved electricity meter didn't display the cumulative output in kWh.

Likewise!

However you can read what ASG have written! If it could be read surely they would have explained how to their customers - rather than them emailing and/or setting up a application on their website?

Perhaps with that type of meter with a GSM phone facility, you need test equipment to interrogate the meter.

Also ASG customers don't need to know how much the panels have generated.

Doc_N

Cardew wrote: »

Also ASG customers don't need to know how much the panels have generated.

Indeed, ASG might prefer their customers not to know how much has been generated, because they might multiply that by 41.3 and reach certain conclusions........

Cardew

Doc_N wrote: »

Indeed, ASG might prefer their customers not to know how much has been generated, because they might multiply that by 41.3 and reach certain conclusions........

Lets tell them then!!

ASG will get an income of approx £1,300 a year from the panels on your roof and you will get 'free' electricity worth between £50 and £100 a year!