company took money, no goods now gone bust

techmob

Hi all

some of you may know of the recent liquidation from CDiscount.co.uk.

I bought 2 tv's for a total of £456 on the 6th October, cut a long story short, i should of had the tv's around the 26th October, they still had no stock so i requested a refund, which they agreed to

I still have not had a refund and they have now gone into provisional liquidation, further more i paid with a debit card (maestro), so my bank don't care and cannot help

i have spoke to trading standards who have given me a template letter stating Consumer Protection (Distance Selling) Regulations 2000 - Goods which i have sent via email and will also by recorded post

someone else mentioned that because they are offshore company my bank can help, i do not know anymore details regarding this, can anyone shed any light

can anything be done?

i feel like i have been mugged , well i have really.

i do not even believe they had any stock of this item (lots of people ordered and no one has had one) and cdiscount stalled over the item until they went into liquidation

that is how i see it

either way i have lost £456

anything i can do ( i am ordering a credit card soon)

once bitten twice shy

thanks for any help

hope something can be done, feels illegal to me

Antispam

Unfortunately unless you can recover money from the company than because of you method of payment you are not covered if you paid by credit card or Visa debt you might be able to claim.

nhoneymonster

I attempted a purchase from a fraudulent company last year on my debit card, I was lucky that the company had their account frozen as there had already been complaints and my money was in the banks holding account so I was able to get it back, but my bank did assist me with this although I paid with a debit card. You could try pestering your bank to see if they will help, it doesn't seem right that they won't do anything. From what I remember I had to put in some sort of claim with the bank and they reclaimed the money from the company's bank.

techmob

apparently because they are not operating in the uk

If you are a UK cardholder who ordered goods online from an overseas website, Maestro says you have the right to a refund if they don't arrive.

So what is an overseas website?

Maestro says it is any website whose "centre of operations" is outside the UK. Which may be the case even if a website name ends with dot uk, it says.

anyone know anymore about this?

BFG_2

Horse and stable door, but..............


NEVER, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER buy something UNLESS you pay with your cc.


Use your cc and you've got massive protection [esp if it's more than £100]

NO CC, NO BUY.

welshblob

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/working_lunch/7593369.stm

Not sure how to get a hold of the Maestro T&C's. Try contacting WL to see if they can help?

Edit : There seems to be a phone number here you can contact Maestro on : http://www.maestrocard.com/uk/paypass/index.html

The_Barbarian

welshblob wrote: »

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/working_lunch/7593369.stm

Not sure how to get a hold of the Maestro T&C's. Try contacting WL to see if they can help?

Edit : There seems to be a phone number here you can contact Maestro on : http://www.maestrocard.com/uk/paypass/index.html

I wouldn't bother with this number, tried this morning. First told me that despite the fact that I was speaking to Maestro they cannot help re. Maestro T&Cs - that is a bank issue apparently (!!). They then tried to claim that despite the fact that I had called Maestro from a Maestro advertised number on a Maestro website, I was not speaking to Maestro. Fat lot of good.

RBS have told me that there is no such term in the Maestro T&C's.

I'm going to push the issue though as CDiscount are quite clearly primarily based in Ireland, and furthermore they have gone into receivership under the Irish branch of Grant Thornton.

If a Maestro spokesperson has stated this on a BBC website, the term must surely have some validity. Its just a case of getting hold of official T&C's.

techmob

collected information from hotukdeals thread, and thanks to the guys over there. This is what i have armed myself with and i will push with this at my bank (natwest)
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Evidence to say they are non-UK:

[/FONT]

1) Their website is registered outside of the UK:
Registrant:
CDISCOUNT

Registrant type:
Unknown

Registrant's address:
4/6 cours de l'Intendance
BORDEAUX CEDEX
33067
France

Registrar:
Melbourne IT DBS, Inc [Tag = IDNAMES]
URL: http://www.melbourneitdbs.com

2) Their website is hosted outside of the UK:
IP Address: 212.147.153.100 (ARIN & RIPE IP search)
IP Location: IE(IRELAND)
DMOZ no listings
Y! Directory: see listings
Data as of: 23-Apr-2008
3) Even their site lists them as registered outside of the UK:
Cdiscount was established in 1998 and is part of the Casino Group. With more than 10,000 stores, the Casino group is one of the largest global retail and distribution organisations. As a group, it consists of companies such as G!ant, Casino Supermarkets, Casino Cafeteria, Monoprix and Franprix/Leaderprice. The Casino group operates in fifteen countries with a particularly strong market presence in France, United States, Mexico, Argentina, Uruguay, Venezuela, Colombia, Brazil, Thailand, Taiwan, Holland and Poland. The Group employs in excess of 200,000 people worldwide.
and:
www.cdiscount.co.uk is a website operated by Cdiscount Retail Limited (we). We are registered in Ireland under company number 454811 and with our registered office at Finnabair Industrial Park, Dundalk, Co. Louth, Ireland.
4) The liquidator was appointed in Ireland and is... Irish:
Dear Customer,
CDISCOUNT RETAIL LIMITED (IN PROVISIONAL LIQUIDATION)
(Cdiscount.co.uk) (“the Company”)

Please be advised that I was appointed Provisional Liquidator of the above company on
Friday 6th November 2009 by the High Court in Ireland.
5) Maestro card issuers should be able to perform chargebacks when the customer orders products or services from companies registered outside of the UK::
However, there is an exception.
If you are a UK cardholder who ordered goods online from an overseas website, Maestro says you have the right to a refund if they don't arrive.
So what is an overseas website?
Maestro says it is any website whose "centre of operations" is outside the UK. Which may be the case even if a website name ends with dot uk, it says.
@ http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/working_lunch/7593369.stm
In addition, if you consult the Maestro Chargeback Guide p483 - http://www.mastercard.com/us/merchant/pdf/TB_CB_Manual.pdf

You will see that the bank need to action chargeback code "4855" for "Goods or Services not
Delivered" which is covered in B.3.10 which is as follows:
:
B.3.10 Intra-European Message Reason Code 4855—Goods or
Services Not Delivered

The following sections describe the proper and improper use of message
reason code 4855.

B.3.10.1 Proper Use of Intra-European Message Reason Code 4855
This message reason code applies only to e-commerce transactions.
The cardholder’s account has been debited for an e-commerce transaction, but
the merchant failed to deliver the goods or services.

B.3.10.2 Improper Use for Issuer’s First Chargeback
This chargeback does not cover situations where the goods or services delivered
by the merchant do not meet the customer’s expectations.

B.3.10.3 Proper Use for Acquirer’s Second Presentment
The condition shown below represents a valid option that the acquirer may
choose to process a second presentment for message reason code 4855

[FONT=&quot]. [/FONT]

The_Barbarian wrote: »

I'm going to push the issue though as CDiscount are quite clearly primarily based in Ireland, and furthermore they have gone into receivership under the Irish branch of Grant Thornton.

If a Maestro spokesperson has stated this on a BBC website, the term must surely have some validity. Its just a case of getting hold of official T&C's.

The_Barbarian

Wow. Thanks for sharing techmob. Someone has done themselves proud with finding that booklet.

Would you be able to post a link to that thread so as I can keep up with any new info on there? Would be much appreciated.

Lets keep our fingers crossed eh.

EDIT. Just checked my emails and I have received a reply from the head of customer services at Cdiscount stating that despite the fact that my purchase was unsecured; "As this was an online transaction you will still be covered by the consumer credit act 1976".

Apart from its obvious connotations, what this means more specifically I don't know. Maybe someone with a bit more knowledge of such things (such as the poster on hotukdeals) might be able shed some light. Hopefully it will be of further help though.

techmob

http://www.hotukdeals.com/item/496621/lg-32lh2000-32-hd-ready-digital-lcd?page=15

if you paid by visa debit you can also do a charge back, maybe this refers to that

i used a maestro to pay, what did you use?

according to here http://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=48872 post 4

There is no protection under the consumer credit act which is where the credit card protections stems from as maestro is a debit rather than credit system.

Protection does exist in terms of contract law etc but this doesnt cause your bank to be liable but protects your rights to pursue the retailer directly rather than through the card issuer.

The_Barbarian wrote: »

Wow. Thanks for sharing techmob. Someone has done themselves proud with finding that booklet.

Would you be able to post a link to that thread so as I can keep up with any new info on there? Would be much appreciated.

Lets keep our fingers crossed eh.

EDIT. Just checked my emails and I have received a reply from the head of customer services at Cdiscount stating that despite the fact that my purchase was unsecured; "As this was an online transaction you will still be covered by the consumer credit act 1976".

Apart from its obvious connotations, what this means more specifically I don't know. Maybe someone with a bit more knowledge of such things (such as the poster on hotukdeals) might be able shed some light. Hopefully it will be of further help though.

The_Barbarian

Yeah, I used a maestro too. I stated that in the email to him, but having searched the net, im prety certain he has got the consumer credit act thing wrong.

Thanks for the links.