Sold laptop to new ebay user -- how to protect seller?

pumpkin_soup

Hi,

I've just sold a laptop on ebay.

The winning bid came in the last 2 seconds from a bidder with 0 feedback, who joined ebay yesterday, whose address is over 200 miles away from me.

Now call me suspicious, but as this is the most expensive item I have sold on ebay (£190), I want to do everything I can to protect myself against "the laptop never turned up" or "it was broken when it arrived".

Does anyone have any tips for scams to look out for, and how to protect myself against them?

I am planning on using a courier for postage -- anything to look out for here? Insurance is a must I would imagine -- are there any couriers that are better to use in this regard?

All advice gratefully received!

amcluesent

Well, I'd seriously consider risking a neg as dead-beat seller, cancel and do a 2nd chance offer, however...

Get their contact info from Ebay, and check against 192.com etc. Bell them on a pretext and gauge their reaction.

If you didn't put serial # in the listing, you're on the back foot. However, use Ebay to contact them and e-mail all serial # to limit chance of getting a broken lappy back. You may also want to put an invisible marking on all the items.

After that, how much did you charge for postage? You can do Parcel Monkey who'll sub-contract to DHL, Fedex etc. and you'll get tracking and delivery confirmation on the interweb

---

DIFFERENT WAYS YOU CAN STEAL THIS LAPTOP OFF ME:

PAYPAL: Paypal is currently ebays preferred method of stealing high value electrical items off sellers. There are a number of various ways you can use to steal this laptop using paypal.

1: A Fake “Item Not Received” (I.N.R) Claim – All you simply have to do here is purchase my item using an unverified paypal account. Then when you receive the laptop, simply claim that you didn’t receive it at your registered (credit card) and paypal will give you all your money back !

2: A Fake “Item Significantly Not As Described” (S.N.A.D) This is a great way to steal items off sellers. Simply start a dispute after you get the laptop making up some lie about the item being damaged etc – You could use Photoshop to make up fake pictures of damage. Paypal will ask you to send the item back to me, but don’t bother – they never enforce that on buyers and after a short wait you will get all your money back and you will still have the laptop.

3: A fake “Unauthorised Use” Claim – This is a super way of stealing items on ebay and is widely used. Simply claim that someone hijacked your account (paypal & ebay) and that you didn’t order the laptop. Then in conjunction with a fake I.N.R claim you can simply steal the laptop and of course, get your money back.

4: A Stolen Credit card – Of course, ebay make no real attempt to vet any of its buyers, so hey, just register a new ebay account using fake ID information and link it to a paypal account set up with a stolen credit card – and hey presto – A free laptop.

---

pumpkin_soup

Hi,

Thanks for the advice. I checked their details in 192.com, and they are not listed. Makes me even more worried!

Looked in Ebay, and I see how to do a second chance offer, but how do I cancel the winning bid? Or do I just do the second chance offer and then refund first winner if/when they pay?

peter_the_piper

Congratulations on a narrow escape. Just goes to show you can not be too careful.

Enfieldian

Next time change your settings to stop 0 feedback buyers bidding on your items as well.

soolin

Enfieldian wrote: »

Next time change your settings to stop 0 feedback buyers bidding on your items as well.

You can't.

JustLittleOldMe_2

Check to see if they have won anything else on Goofbay

pumpkin_soup

Hi,

Thanks for all the great advice. I cancelled the auction under the pretext that I had discovered that the laptop was no longer working, refunded the buyer, and the buyer accepted the ebay cancellation request, so no fees and a happy outcome. (although now I feel a bit guilty that the buyer may well have been totally legit!)

Offered to the second highest bidder, but no response as yet, so I will probably have to relist. Looks like I need to:
- include the serial number in the auction
- invisibly mark laptop (and state in the auction that I have done this)
- disallow bids from zero feedback buyers

Anything else I should be doing to minimize risk?

Thanks for all your help!

peter_the_piper

Suggest you mark screen, battery, memory chips and processor if possible. Common to swap these out from a duff one.

cyberbob

You were a bit foolish the way you handled this. You could have quite easily got neged and reported as a non performing seller. The fact that the buyer accepted your cancellation it looks like you have refused a perfectly good sale.

1. You can't block Zero feedback bidders. You could cancel there bids but if the snipe like your bidder did you can't stop them. We were all Zero bidders at one point. Some of my best customers have been zero bidders
2. Most of amcluesent points can be easily defended against (its a very old list) i'll explain that later.
3. If your selling a laptop and you have very little feedback yourself you are more likely to be targeted by scammers. There are some straighforward ways to protect yourself
4. Seller preferences - Set them to exclude overseas bidders (where most of the scams come from). Also exclude those with 2 or more strikes and only accept bids from those with a credit card on file.
5. Description - Make sure that you put lots of photos and a description of every possible problem. What is included and whats not
6. Invisibly marking the laptop with a UV pen only helps if you have to go to the police or the small claims court. It will not help in a paypal case. I would never put the serial number in a listing as that opens you up to other scams (including insurance fraud). As long as you have good pictures (including any scratches etc) and a good description you can fight a SNAD case. (Make sure full specification is listed along with any upgrades or downgrades
7. If you receive a winning bid from someone with Zero feedback. Check on goofbay. See if they have one or bid on lots of other high end goods. IF so they are likely to be a scammer. If they are a nigerian scammer they will not pay you will only get a fake paypal email. If you think it is this is a great guide to get you FVF back HERE
8. Check payament details in payapl only (don't believe emails)
9. Send special delivery (or equivalent courier) to paypal address only. For seller protection via paypal an item over £150 you need online proof of signature

DIFFERENT WAYS YOU CAN STEAL THIS LAPTOP OFF ME:

PAYPAL: Paypal is currently ebays preferred method of stealing high value electrical items off sellers. There are a number of various ways you can use to steal this laptop using paypal.

1: A Fake “Item Not Received” (I.N.R) Claim – All you simply have to do here is purchase my item using an unverified paypal account. Then when you receive the laptop, simply claim that you didn’t receive it at your registered (credit card) and paypal will give you all your money back !

All you need to do is when you receive the payment check to see if Paypal say that you are ok to send (it says this in both email and online) Then you are covered by seller protection. It will also say if your applicable to seller protection

2: A Fake “Item Significantly Not As Described” (S.N.A.D) This is a great way to steal items off sellers. Simply start a dispute after you get the laptop making up some lie about the item being damaged etc – You could use Photoshop to make up fake pictures of damage. Paypal will ask you to send the item back to me, but don’t bother – they never enforce that on buyers and after a short wait you will get all your money back and you will still have the laptop.

Good photos and description. If it was damaged in transit this also would need to shown to RM including packaging. You have to be an expert to be able to photoshop this well. Most attempts can be easily seen. If you are suspicious you rport to police as its fraud and take it from there. In all my years on ebay I have never heard of anyone doing this. Its always a friend of a friend

3: A fake “Unauthorised Use” Claim – This is a super way of stealing items on ebay and is widely used. Simply claim that someone hijacked your account (paypal & ebay) and that you didn’t order the laptop. Then in conjunction with a fake I.N.R claim you can simply steal the laptop and of course, get your money back.

As the seller as long as you have done everything correct you are covered by paypal seller protection and would not lose money

4: A Stolen Credit card – Of course, ebay make no real attempt to vet any of its buyers, so hey, just register a new ebay account using fake ID information and link it to a paypal account set up with a stolen credit card – and hey presto – A free laptop.

This makes no difference to you as a seller you will not lose money as you will be covered by Paypal seller protection policies


I sell about 10 laptops/desktops a year with very few problems most of it is common sense and making sure you follow correct procedures. Your biggest problem as a newish seller will be possible nigerian scams but these are more of a pain than a huge problem. If you are confident and have good listings that puts 99% of possible scammers off

You were very lucky that you didn't get slammed by your buyer for jumping the gun. Also did ebay officially offer a 2nd chance offer? If not you will have to put another listing up if the 2nd bidder wants it so that you will be covered by all the correct procedures. One thing though if you do have problems its sometimes worth remembering that Paypal don't always know there own rules so sometimes you have to remind them. Seller protection rules HERE

The biggest thing is to understand paypals protection rules and remember Zero feedback buyers are people to. We were all one at one time, in fact I was the other day when I opened a new buying account.

peter_the_piper

You forgot the deterrent effect of mentioning the marking. Whereas a professional scammer would not be put off it should reduce the opportunist ones. Gotta agree with the rest of the post though.