Yesterday's farm..what if it comes back?

rhiwfield

Charco wrote: »

Have you thought about cooking (even the non cooking apples) and turning them into something you could save in jars etc

I love diced apples in my home made curry!

Sorry Charco, thats what I meant by conversion. We use a lot of the soft fruit to make preserves and our failed attempt at bottling this year was then frozen instead as pie fillings. Its certainly an option but wouldnt cope with anything like a full crop when the trees are fully productive. Our freezer is now full of home made stock, pies, fillings, frozen veg etc (hence our try at bottling). One thing we might have a go at is drying fruit, my son in law has been given an old fruit dryer by his mum and dad and that might be worth a bash next year!

Charco_2

Sounds good, I'm a complete new comer to all this gardening melarky (my garden in my old house wasn't exactly shaped/conducive to gardening other than a lawn) but i've moved house now and cleared my new garden all ready for a go at a small-ish veg patch (for now) and i've a handful of fruit trees to try out too.

I've had great satisfaction from growing a pepper plant in the house! Got about 5 peppers off it so far and there's some more still on it! ha ha (nothing compared to all you guys and your farms but for me it was an achievement and hopefully just the start of it!)

choille

Good for you Charco, you've got the bug.

lostinrates

rhiwfield wrote: »

Sorry Charco, thats what I meant by conversion. We use a lot of the soft fruit to make preserves and our failed attempt at bottling this year was then frozen instead as pie fillings. Its certainly an option but wouldnt cope with anything like a full crop when the trees are fully productive. Our freezer is now full of home made stock, pies, fillings, frozen veg etc (hence our try at bottling). One thing we might have a go at is drying fruit, my son in law has been given an old fruit dryer by his mum and dad and that might be worth a bash next year!

A neighbour of ours makes apple juice which he freezes with his and another neighbour's extras. He serves this as the fruit juice element of his breakfast...running a B and B. Also of course, there is cider. Drying would be ace. I mainly freeze as pealed and quatered or sauce. I also make lots of herb jellies which use apple as a base, and use apple or apple juce for less bountiful fruits in jams/jellies.

RAS

rhiwfield wrote: »

choille,

RAS seems to be the one to advise but here's a couple of websites:

http://www.orangepippinshop.com/products.aspx?collectionid=1006

this one looks a good site but almost sold out! still, recommends varieties and an alternative supplier

Interesting to see what has happened at Butterworths!

Just a quickie: it might be worth contacting these people http://rubha-phoil.manvell.org.uk/woodland/tour_2.htm and asking them which varieties grow on Skye?

Also go to Inverewe or ring them as they had some espaliers (pears and apples I think) on south facing slopes that were very heavy with fruit both times I went.

There are about 20 Scottish varieties of apple and 10 of pear - will list later. The main growing areas where Midlothian, Ayrshire and the Carse of Gowrie. The biggest single factors are going to be shelter, shelter and shelter and then southern aspect and anything close by to retain and reflect heat.

choille

Thanks RAS - I'll go into Inverewe as it's not too far away from me.
I think I had the Katy & James Grieve apple trees at a previous address by looking at photos on one of the web sites.
If I had oodles of dosh I would have a walled garden built, but have to make do with hacking at the wilderness. Should really put up some wind breaks, but so much else to do at the moment.

RAS

choille

Do not have the apples list here but this is the list of putative Scottish pears, all listed in ancient Scottish orchards as part the recent surveys.

Benvie
Craig's Favourite
Drummond aka Charnock
Galston's Muirfowl Egg
Golden Knap, – not considered very good
Green Pear of Yair – the only one that appears to be commercially available.
Kilwhinning
Longueville , it is conjectured that the tree was brought over from that country by The Douglas when Lord of Longueville in the 15th century
Maggie Duncan
Winter Christie
Chalk
Rattray
Laird Lang
Grey Honey
Maggie
Gourdiehill
Flower of Monorgan
Seggieden

You can spot the location of origin for a lot of these. There are a number of other imports that certainly grow well in Midlothian and Tayside.

RAS

choille wrote: »

James Grieve apple trees

Classic Scottish apple that just about copes in the south.

choille wrote: »

If I had oodles of dosh I would have a walled garden built, but have to make do with hacking at the wilderness. Should really put up some wind breaks, but so much else to do at the moment

Will try and find some links to Holzer.

http://www.permaculture.org.uk/mm.asp?mmfile=Article_Alpine_garden

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bw7mQZHfFVE

Also lokk here although it is basic - the farm featured in farm for the Future http://www.konsk.co.uk/index.htm

choille

Listen RAS - That's really helpful.
Midlothian & Tayside are quite mild compared to here, but stuff certainly grows & I am making use of natural shelters - ie Birch trees that have self seeded.
We are actually still eating our lettuce that is still growing - outside. I use no pestisides, but do use dung from my sheep & comfrey feed I make & also sea weed as the soil fertility is really poor.

I hadn't heard of this Holzer - the article is really fascinating. Unfortunately the speakers on my computer are jiggered, so I can't hear the utube thing, but I'll see if I can dig anything else up on this guy as he sounds like he knows what he's doing.
In Btw I'm probably going to get some pigs in the spring to enable me to clear some ground as I'm struggling at the bottom of my croft doing it by hand & it's starting to all feel a bit much - bad day today - lol.
Many thanks for all this info
Much appreciated.

RAS

choile

The orchards I refer to in Tayside were large commercial ones; think Vale of Evesham and Kent,, until cheaper rail freight and high corn prices altered growing priorities. Garden apples and pears have always been grown in more marginal conditions.

I have seen orchards in Scandinavia that suggest that part of the problem of fruit in the NW is the limits of our imagination and application. One of the Scottish apples below was developed in Wester Ross if I remember rightly. I am sure others could be developed but apple developers make more money from a tree that met the needs of the southern market. Interestingly a lot of Scottish apples do very badly in England unless grown several hundred feet up in the hardy areas. Unless you are very close to the sea (salt-laden winds) or far in land (particularly cold) I would expect fruit trees to stand up to NW Scottish weather. After all we get weeks when the night time temperature is not above -11C and periods when day-time is below freezing for two weeks or more.

You mentioned Katy; a Swedish-raised cross between James Grieve and Worcester Pearmain. I suspect that you could raid the larder in Scandinavia for other useful varieties.

Also consider Gravenstein M 3 dessert, partial tip-bearer but spurs freely. Forms the basis (90 per cent) of the Norwegian apple orchards in Sognfjord, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sogndal where it is grown as a half standard (sensible form for a tip bearer). It is however very early flowering triploid so needs partnering with care (two other varieties from flowering periods 1 - 7). I did not meet anyone who could advise what the other varieties are. Most local houses have several apple trees in their gardens as well. They also grow morello cherries (commercially for Harrods!) although the ones near Urnes stave church looked a bit frosted.


Dessert apples
Oslin/Arbroath Pippin VE 6
Bloody Ploughman M12 1883 (Keeper's)
Coul Blush M 7 1827
Hood's Supreme M 12 1924 poor cropper
Johnny Johnstone ? M
Lady of the Lake M 12
Lemon Queen E14
Lord Rosebery M 10
Lovacka Renata M14
Malcolm's Delight E 6
Port Allen Russet M 5
Thorle Pippin E 6

Dual use
Early Julyan – Tam Montgomery? E 9 (Keeper's)
James Grieve M 10
Liddel's Seedling E 7
White Melrose M 10 (Keeper's)
Maggie Sinclair M 11 pt tb

Culinary
Beauty of Moray E 10 (Keeper's)
Cambusnethan Pippin M 15 (Keeper's) pt tb
Clydesdale E 6
East Lothian Pippin E 9 ? Dual purpose?
Galloway Pippin L 14
Lady of Wemyss L 9 (Keeper's)
Lass O'Gowrie E 8
Scotch Bridget L 11(Keeper's)
Scotch Dumpling M 5
Seaton House M 14
Stirling Castle M 11 (Keeper's)
Stobo Castle (Keeper's) E 10
Tower of Glamis L 5 (Keeper's)
White Paradise E 19