Unenforceability & Template Letters II

daz10277

never-in-doubt wrote: »

That doesn't look enforceable to me! Let me check it out and will confirm later for you, just a bit busy right now

Either way, i'd be sending the following letter to them: "h t t p://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?p=26867797#post26867797"]3. CCA Query

Let them come back to you and tell you why they think it is enforceable...

Hiya NID

Whilst you're checking out my CCA (thanks for that! ), I've been looking at it again and cannot work out how they reached the interest figure. I also thought they had included the admin fee in the total credit and charged interest (which I know is a no no) but I'm pretty sure this isn't the case after a second look (?)

Anyway, I've used some loan calculators on the net and none calculate the amount of interest as stated on the CCA based on the APR stated. I've also used the calculators to work back the APR based on the repayment amount, period and loan amount and it still doesn't add up (it makes the APR 19.6% and the CCA says 18.7%).

Am I on the right track or was interest calculated differently 10 years ago?

I also found this:-

"Paragraph 1A of schedule 7 of the Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations says
Quote:
For the purposes of these Regulations, it shall be sufficient compliance with the requirement to show the APR if there is included in the document--
(1) a rate which exceed the APR by not more than one; or
(2) a rate which falls short of the APR by not more than 0.1 "

Being a noob in these matters, is this relevant or am I talking c**p? (which is usually the case). If by any chance I've stumbled onto something, would this make it unenforceable??

Whaddya reckon??? :question:

never-in-doubt

I reckon it is unenforceable as I originally stated mate - 100%! Just send the dispute letter and let them write back to you.... dont worry too much about the ins-and-outs....

The fact they added the fee to the loan is what the recent RBS victory was over so not worth going there cos the lender will use that as precedent. Just send the dispute letter off....

This Letter: 3. CCA Query

Interest was worked out the same back then, there are several things wrong with the CCA, prescribed terms are not intact for a start as are payment and interest amounts (as you noticed)...

Dojo_Jo_Jo

'Ahh, dont worry about the bank decision - seems we can get round this using regs 5 & 8 as opposed to reg 6 which the OFT originally went in with :D

It may be a short 'victory' of sorts :rolleyes:'

Phew!!!!!!!!!!!!! :T

daz10277

never-in-doubt wrote: »

I reckon it is unenforceable as I originally stated mate - 100%! Just send the dispute letter and let them write back to you.... dont worry too much about the ins-and-outs....

The fact they added the fee to the loan is what the recent RBS victory was over so not worth going there cos the lender will use that as precedent. Just send the dispute letter off....

This Letter: [URL="h t t p://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?p=26867797#post26867797"]3. CCA Query[/URL]

Interest was worked out the same back then, there are several things wrong with the CCA, prescribed terms are not intact for a start as are payment and interest amounts (as you noticed)...

Hi NID

Ok cheers, will send off letter . Didn't know about the RBS case (that's why I'm a noob). Should I query the interest bit in the letter or just send it as it is??

Dojo_Jo_Jo

Last question, then you are free for at least 30 days or until I get my replies back !

Re the Barclay Loan that I am about to go down the request for my CCA with tomorrow.

Original loan set up 2004 but in Oct 2007 I was offered more credit at a better rate which resulted in my monthly payments remaining the same whilst the difference between what I owed already and my 'top up' was credited to my bank.

For the 2007 top up, the loan was given a new reference, but I do not recall being asked to sign a new agreement.

As the original loan was in 2004, if I hadn't signed anything in 2007 because it was set up on the phone, can I still claim or as I had a new account number from 2007 does in count as a new loan?

Sorry if it's a bit confusing. Hope you get the gist.

never-in-doubt

daz10277 wrote: »

Hi NID

Ok cheers, will send off letter . Didn't know about the RBS case (that's why I'm a noob). Should I query the interest bit in the letter or just send it as it is??

Just send it as is..... RBS (McGuffick) case is here: McGuffick v RBS judgment

This case and its ruling centred on whether defaults in these cases can be passed to credit reference agencies – as McGuffick had stopped repaying his debt as enforceability of loans was still being settled.

Additional case heard at Leeds - Mitchell v HBOS

never-in-doubt

Dojo_Jo_Jo wrote: »

Last question, then you are free for at least 30 days or until I get my replies back !

Re the Barclay Loan that I am about to go down the request for my CCA with tomorrow.

Original loan set up 2004 but in Oct 2007 I was offered more credit at a better rate which resulted in my monthly payments remaining the same whilst the difference between what I owed already and my 'top up' was credited to my bank.

For the 2007 top up, the loan was given a new reference, but I do not recall being asked to sign a new agreement.

As the original loan was in 2004, if I hadn't signed anything in 2007 because it was set up on the phone, can I still claim or as I had a new account number from 2007 does in count as a new loan?

Sorry if it's a bit confusing. Hope you get the gist.

I get you lol - you need to wait for the CCA first. Then i'd SAR them and see what they have exactly. From this it would be an idea to work out the facts prior to second guessing them

Dojo_Jo_Jo

never-in-doubt wrote: »

I get you lol - you need to wait for the CCA first. Then i'd SAR them and see what they have exactly. From this it would be an idea to work out the facts prior to second guessing them

Will do! Already written the envelope!!

Thanks:D

Goodtimesahead

NID

I received a CCA reply from Nat West and I would appreciate your comments on this part of the letter

"It has come to our attention that your account was opened 16 September 1983 and Section 78 was brought into force on 19 May 1985. Schedule 3 of the 1974 Act states that S.78 applies to an agreement made from 19 May 1985 onwards where the agreement would have then been a regulated agreement."

"As such under regulation 9 of the Copy Documents regulations specifies that in the case of an agreement made before 19 May 1985 it is sufficient to supply a copy of the current terms that acts as a true copy. I therefore enclose these documents and confirm that we have now fully complied with your request. This means that your agreement is enforceable."

Goodtimesahead

Sorry this is the 1st para of that letter.

Your written request for information made under s78 (1) of the Consumer Credit Act must be accompanied by payment of a fee of £1, which we have received and has been applied to your account accordingly.

We are obliged to provide you with a "true" copy of the credit agreement and a statement of financial information relating to the account, namely, the state of the account, amount currently due, with amounts and due dates of future payments that still require to be made. In terms of CCA copy regulations, the "true" copy requirement can be satisfied by providing a copy agreement at the date the card agreement was made and providing that plus a copy of the current terms of the card agreement."