Student trying to get out of a tenancy agreement

blckbrd

Good point about my ommissions RobertoMoir - Apologies OP.

CT calculation is based on a standard of 2 persons living in a dwelling/household.

The students have already been assessed on this basis and are exempt. Unless they each receive individual bills, they live in a household. The 'professional' is now a member of that hosehold and unless she is a professional doley, she would have liability to pay council tax for that dwelling/household.

I would suspect that even if the pro were a seperate household, with her own bill, she would still be liable for CT - don't know if banding might be affected but then that's not OP's problem

RobertoMoir

blckbrd wrote: »

Good point about my ommissions RobertoMoir - Apologies OP.

CT calculation is based on a standard of 2 persons living in a dwelling/household.

The students have already been assessed on this basis and are exempt. Unless they each receive individual bills, they live in a household. The 'professional' is now a member of that hosehold and unless she is a professional doley, she would have liability to pay council tax for that dwelling/household.

I would suspect that even if the pro were a seperate household, with her own bill, she would still be liable for CT - don't know if banding might be affected but then that's not OP's problem

I reckon the LL would be liable for C'tax now that the professional lady is living there on two counts, firstly that there are several "households" there as you note, and secondly that at least two occupants probably don't class student digs as their main address. Of course they'd charge the working tenant extra in their rent to make up for this, but the LL is the person who I would imagine should be billed.

I honestly don't think the OP has a single thing to worry about as regards being liable for the C'tax, however they'd want to ensure that it was being paid as they don't want to deal with bailiffs on the doorstep, hence a query to the council. The sub-text here of course is not that they are likely to have to pay c'tax (we both agree there) but that they want to get out of the tenancy due the changes from what they originally agreed to, and one way of doing that is to make yourself such a pain that the others would be glad to get shot of you.

Either way the whole thing sounds like a right mess. Frankly the LL has caused themselves a lot of trouble and paperwork and effort by putting someone in a full time job into what is effectively student accomadation.

Fire_Fox

Even tho full time students are exempt from council tax, the hierachy of liability applies if there are any non-students in the household. So in this case the students would not be counted, so the professional counts as a sole resident BUT as all the tenants are named on the tenancy agreeement all are equally liable for the full bill (75% of total).

I looked into this very carefully a few months ago as I was a full time student and my partner not. We got a 25% discount as I was exempt BUT if he hadn't paid I was solely liable as an owner-occupier I am further up the hierachy of liability. :eek:

RobertoMoir

Fire_Fox wrote: »

Even tho full time students are exempt from council tax, the hierachy of liability applies if there are any non-students in the household. So in this case the students would not be counted, so the professional counts as a sole resident BUT as all the tenants are named on the tenancy agreeement all are equally liable for the full bill (75% of total).

I looked into this very carefully a few months ago as I was a full time student and my partner not. We got a 25% discount as I was exempt BUT if he hadn't paid I was solely liable as an owner-occupier I am further up the hierachy of liability. :eek:

Yeah this is what I'm thinking about. I personally think that the LL would be liable for the reasons I've already mentioned, but if that isn't the case and the tenants are liable then each of them could be held jointly and severally liable.

Fire_Fox

RobertoMoir wrote: »

Yeah this is what I'm thinking about. I personally think that the LL would be liable for the reasons I've already mentioned, but if that isn't the case and the tenants are liable then each of them could be held jointly and severally liable.

The landlord cannot be liable for council tax if he or she doesn't live in the property. The council only care about who is a permanent resident in the property, not who is or is not named on a tenancy agreement. This professional is a resident as he or she does not have another home address; a dispute over the tenancy agreement is not the concern of the council.

We have had cases on these boards before where tenancy agreements have stated the landlord will pay the council tax but hasn't - the tenants remain liable according to the council and have to claim the money back from the landlord through the small claims process.

adg1

I am under the impression that if tenants swap around on a Joint Tenancy then ALL remaining tenants AND the new person HAVE to sign a new tenancy agreement. Without your signature (as a tenant that has stayed and is involved in the new tenancy) then I'm pretty sure its not a valid TA.

It does sound, though, as it was done so fast without you there that you are all on seperate agreements. If this is so then offer notice and leave, with the landlord responsible for finding your replacement.

If you are on a joint and several TA for the whole property, with 3 named tenants, then advice in paragraph 1 stands, and continue looking for a replacement.

With regards to council tax, it becomes payable for the WHOLE property when 1 tenant is working, though at a discounted rate. Students are NOT liable for council tax. Call the council tax department and make sure that the other tenant is paying in full as I'm sure they would be very interested to find out! Then there would be two people looking to move out and the final tenant may well become more amenable to new people being found.

Blacksheep1979

you don't have to sign a tenancy agreement to have a tenancy in principal. The act of paying rent on a regular basis would be enough to prove you are a tenant.

System

i thought inregards to CT as long as only 1 person was in employment it wouldn't be affected, only when there's 2 or more does it become a problem. Well thats what the guy at the council told me when i asked about our house situation (2 working, 2 students, and lil ol me on CTB..)

RobertoMoir

xXMessedUpXx wrote: »

i thought inregards to CT as long as only 1 person was in employment it wouldn't be affected, only when there's 2 or more does it become a problem. Well thats what the guy at the council told me when i asked about our house situation (2 working, 2 students, and lil ol me on CTB..)

I suspect that you received specific advice about your particular situation, whatever that may be exactly, rather than general advice about council tax liability on a property.

WoldView83

Hi been reading your posts and had to comment regarding your joint and severally liable contract and the new tenant (the professional) as this happened to me. This seems your real problem.

Bear with me.

We originally signed a 3 person contract qith 2 professionals and 1 a student- 1 professional then moved out and moved a professional guy in - we didn't like him but it wasn't up to us who moved in - we were never asked to sign a new contract, which we never actually thought about UNTIL he didn't pay his rent, his council tax , any of the shared bills and then stole (minor things) but then became physically violent and threatening, smashing the place up when drunk. Suddenly major problem. Especially when the LA began asking us for rent - never of course considering evicting the *******.. Because, according to the tenancy, yes were all jointly liable. For everything.

So...we asked the LA about the contract. And got legal advice. The new tenant should not thave been allowed to move in unless a new contract was created with our signatures on it - names alone DO NOT COUNT. The only document with our signatures on it was the original contract. THerefore, the rent et al reverted to the 3 original tenant - still a problme for us since we'd have to try and find the original 3rd person to pay for this ******* bills, rent etc (And to be fair, she didn't know what a git he turned out to be...or at least I hope she didn't) .

However, we kicked up such a stink with the uni and the LA for putting us in danger with someone they'd never credit checked or reference checked and didn't even have a proper contract for that it was easier for them to move us out. In the end. But it was a huge stress over several months, there was the threat of court action until the LA caved at the last minute.

Basically, as other have said, this could be a major major problem in its own right (Never mind the smoke!) and you need to get it sorted as a matter of urgency. Plenty of good advice above about who to see - LA for a start to get contract clarified, CAB, Uni etc.

Good luck. And apologies for waffling.

EDIT - sorry - realised whole point isn't clear...IF you are in this situation with the contract - this new professional person will not have a valid tenancy if you all haven't signed to it; therefore the original contract stands (including the person who's left and yourself) - meaning you'll be liable not only for your own rent but their's as well, jointly and severally.