Advice on Learner Legal 125cc Motorbike please

DCodd

My O/H's son is taking his CBT this Wednesday, he is looking to buy a 125cc motorbike (traditional bike style not scooter, probably sports model with the drop style handlebars). which one? We have £600 - 800 for the bike.

These Chinese clones, are they any good? Have seen some reports on motorbike forums that they are unreliable and dangerous in the wet while others say they are great.

Would he be able to get an early CBR (2004ish) for this money? I am assuming a 4 stroke would be better than a 2 stroke

Any advice would be appreciated. thanks

Premier_2

I'm not sure where the safety fears in the wet originate from? Nothing a new set of tyres wouldn't solve I suspect.
I'm not sure if reliability is the issue with Chinese models, more durability. i.e. the cheap engine doesn't last as long.

However, the main issue with cheap chinese models would be the availability of spare parts I would imagine. Buying a well known brand, such as a Honda you suggest, means there will be a dealer local who whould be able to source any parts you need, if not actually held in stock.

4 stoke Vs 2 stroke Vs always a good cause for debate. Personally I prefer a 4-stroke because they are cleaner/less smelly and you don't need to faff about mixing oil to the petrol. However, the 4 stroke engine is more complicated so more prone to go wrong, especially if abused/over revved (less of a problem with modern engines as they often have rev limiters). ... and a 2 stroke is probably a bit quicker too.

negg

The Chinese clones are very good. Expect to scrap them when they get to about 18 months old though! I spoke to a guy at the MOT place and he said every Chinese bike that came for it's first MOT (3 years old) was a failure and the cost to put it back on the road made it a write off. Every single one!

A friend of mine bought a Chinese 600cc bike and after one year, it looked 10 years old and was so rusty it was unbelievable!

NOTE: When you do a CBT, you are not just limited to a 125cc, but you are also limited to 15bhp.

This means that an Aprilia 125cc needs to be restricted to 15bhp because as standard they are 33bhp. So be careful on this. And yes, the police do tend to know what they are looking for to check if it is restricted or not.

I had the CBR125 for two years and it was a very good bike.

DCodd

negg wrote: »

NOTE: When you do a CBT, you are not just limited to a 125cc, but you are also limited to 15bhp.

.

Thanks, yes I was made aware of this and have seen some 125's advertised as learner legal but the spec's show it was above the 15bhp limit (and one was the aforementioned un restricted 33bhp Aprilia).

Premier_2

negg wrote: »

...NOTE: When you do a CBT, you are not just limited to a 125cc, but you are also limited to 15bhp....

Good point! That probably nullifies my earlier suggestion that a 2 stoke might be any quicker.

sebdangerfield

I love my bikes and had an rs 125 and then the rs250. The two strokes are definately quicker and more fun as they need to be revved to about 9000 before you get any power! Saying that, my 125 wasn't restricted.

I did the CBT as a full car license holder and just wanted to get into motorcycles. I was astonished that kids of 16 and 17 who could not have had any experience of how the roads work, lane usage even the very basics were able to do a one day course and then go out on the road. I'd suggest trying to talk him into getting some experience in a car or propper lessons on a bike to get his cat A and get him some more experience as soon as you can after the cbt, if indeed, he hasn't already. I strongly believe riding a bike can make you a far better driver and vice versa

My favorite bike in that category are;

Two stokes
RS125, great engine, propper sports bike 125 racer
Cagiva Mito, stunning looks. designed by massimo tamborini think ducatti 918

Four strokes
CBR125, reliable and Honda so wont melt in the winter grit
Sachs XTC 125, don't know alot about it other than sachs used to only make suspension parts but moved into bikes, stunning looking, rubbish name!

DCodd

sebdangerfield wrote: »

I love my bikes and had an rs 125 and then the rs250. The two strokes are definately quicker and more fun as they need to be revved to about 9000 before you get any power! Saying that, my 125 wasn't restricted.

I did the CBT as a full car license holder and just wanted to get into motorcycles. I was astonished that kids of 16 and 17 who could not have had any experience of how the roads work, lane usage even the very basics were able to do a one day course and then go out on the road. I'd suggest trying to talk him into getting some experience in a car or propper lessons on a bike to get his cat A and get him some more experience as soon as you can after the cbt, if indeed, he hasn't already. I strongly believe riding a bike can make you a far better driver and vice versa

My favorite bike in that category are;

Two stokes
RS125, great engine, propper sports bike 125 racer
Cagiva Mito, stunning looks. designed by massimo tamborini think ducatti 918

Four strokes
CBR125, reliable and Honda so wont melt in the winter grit
Sachs XTC 125, don't know alot about it other than sachs used to only make suspension parts but moved into bikes, stunning looking, rubbish name!

He wants to get a couple of months actual riding experience before he takes his full bike test, is that not a good idea?

We saw a Sachs XTC 125 on ebay for £700, I think they look great with the red frame work but I think he likes the CBRs.

sebdangerfield

If he likes the CBRs then go for it. They're the most reliable of the bunch and honda build quality is superb.

He wants to get a couple of months actual riding experience before he takes his full bike test, is that not a good idea?

I don't mean it's a bad idea, it's just very sobering to think its legal to go out on the road in that position.

Think back to passing your car test, you had lessons, lots of them! You either had a theory test or were asked questions on the highway code at the end of your test and if there was any doubt on your skill for driving or knowledge of the highway code you failed and did it all again. You wouldn't imagine a driving instructor putting you in for your test if you didn't know how islands worked for example.

Compare that to a cbt. You can be 16 years old. Never even been on a road let alone driven something on one. You don't need a theory test, you don't need a hazard perception test and you have 7 hours of training in one day. Those 7 hours are split into 3 hours theory, 1 hour lunch and then another 3 hours practical (including the test). The theory has to include how helmets are constructed and the legalities of wearing one, how to maintain a machine (chain etc) and what the controls are before moving onto how a road works and how to drive on one! The the practical is split into control of the machine on a car park around cones and emergency stops before the last part is actualy out on a road. To me, its not enough but it just depends on how grown up he is and how he'l handle being on a bike surrounded by other cars having very little experience of how it all works.

DCodd

sebdangerfield wrote: »

Think back to passing your car test, you had lessons, lots of them! You either had a theory test or were asked questions on the highway code at the end of your test and if there was any doubt on your skill for driving or knowledge of the highway code you failed and did it all again. You wouldn't imagine a driving instructor putting you in for your test if you didn't know how islands worked for example.

Compare that to a cbt. You can be 16 years old. Never even been on a road let alone driven something on one. You don't need a theory test, you don't need a hazard perception test and you have 7 hours of training in one day. Those 7 hours are split into 3 hours theory, 1 hour lunch and then another 3 hours practical (including the test). The theory has to include how helmets are constructed and the legalities of wearing one, how to maintain a machine (chain etc) and what the controls are before moving onto how a road works and how to drive on one! The the practical is split into control of the machine on a car park around cones and emergency stops before the last part is actualy out on a road. To me, its not enough but it just depends on how grown up he is and how he'l handle being on a bike surrounded by other cars having very little experience of how it all works.

Fair point, when I was sixteen and I just went out and bought my AP50 fell off on the way home and continued to do so, most days, for the following year! Which is why I am asking for advice, as clearly me and Bikes do not mix!:D

BillScarab

sebdangerfield wrote: »

If he likes the CBRs then go for it. They're the most reliable of the bunch and honda build quality is superb.



I don't mean it's a bad idea, it's just very sobering to think its legal to go out on the road in that position.

Think back to passing your car test, you had lessons, lots of them! You either had a theory test or were asked questions on the highway code at the end of your test and if there was any doubt on your skill for driving or knowledge of the highway code you failed and did it all again. You wouldn't imagine a driving instructor putting you in for your test if you didn't know how islands worked for example.

Compare that to a cbt. You can be 16 years old. Never even been on a road let alone driven something on one. You don't need a theory test, you don't need a hazard perception test and you have 7 hours of training in one day. Those 7 hours are split into 3 hours theory, 1 hour lunch and then another 3 hours practical (including the test). The theory has to include how helmets are constructed and the legalities of wearing one, how to maintain a machine (chain etc) and what the controls are before moving onto how a road works and how to drive on one! The the practical is split into control of the machine on a car park around cones and emergency stops before the last part is actualy out on a road. To me, its not enough but it just depends on how grown up he is and how he'l handle being on a bike surrounded by other cars having very little experience of how it all works.

It's a good point but there are other factors. If he's spent a lot of time riding a bicycle on the road that will stand him in good stead for example.

sebdangerfield

Totally agree, i'd never want to put anyone off a bike. I've had som much fun on them and I really do think you need to ride one to be a truly good driver.

It's just worrying to think thats all the training you need in this modern world of health and safety!

That said, i'd go for the rs as it was quicker and had more respect from bikers on bike bikes. It was also so unreliable that it taught me so much about mechanics!

If he likes the cbr, get one. I've never heard a bad word about them and as I mentioned earlier, the build quality is far better. I had a suzuki at the same time as my mate had a Honda hornet. both were commuted on through winter, I cleaned mine weekly and looked after it well. he, did nothing more than spray it off twice! Come the next summer, he still had the bike with the least rust!

The only thing I was put off by with the cbr was my size! I'm a big fella and when I was on the CBR I felt like I was riding a pencil!