Is EMA Fair???

sp1987

I can only talk from an experience of having received the money. I do find it a bit insulting when people imply that those receiving it are just putting off their minimum wage job for longer. Although I would have no shame taking whatever job I needed to if needs must, I never intended to leave education only qualified for such a role. I have a degree, but I would work for minimum wage if I needed to.

I had EMA during college which paid for my travel costs and course related materials.

The bad points were that most course related costs appear in september when your course starts; books, travel, stationary, etc etc. I know people who dropped out of college before they got their award as it took so long to come through (mine was late November if I remember correctly?!). Those who could not afford to get to college, the intended targets of the money, left before it was able to help them. I'm not sure if you are able to apply in the summer prior to college now but at that time we had to start the application once we were at college. Sometimes the call centre ''lost'' who you were, fabulous, or did not recognise your college as an institution they could award for, deep joy! This seemed to sort itself out over time though.

I had something like £300 in a lump and then bought all the books/accessories etc I thought would be helpful for my courses, but lost initial use of them (from september) so had to ''catch up''. I took 4 as levels and 3 a levels. The bonuses are also useless, especially the ones in april/the summer which, if used on books, rendered those books useless after a month of use at best (great, money for textbooks a week before the exam when you had no time to read them!). It would be better to spread this extra money over the whole year. Even the poorest kids in my experience, ended up using this money for other means than they would have done if given to them with the other payments. Few people buy revision books they will not have time to read, they end up helping their parents with bills which is not what the money is for.

I would have chosen to go to college/uni either way, but it enabled me to do it easily without having to work all my evenings and missing out on coursework/assessments/revision. Some people really struggling need to work as early as possible to support their low income parents who may be unable to work, this money provides an alternative. I only met one person who really had all the money to ''blow'' on alcohol and cigarettes as they were provided for by their parents, I am unsure how.

bumpoowee

What !!!!es me off most about EMA is that firstly when I was at college nobody paid anything for me - so what relevance does parental income have?

Secondly I worked 5-10.15 Friday night and 7am-5pm on Saturday all the way through college, for the princely sum of £45.60 a week, more or less the same as EMA. So I sacrificed the best part of every weekend for what now supposedly 'deprived' students get for doing sweet FA.

I don't blame anyone for claiming EMA, but I very much blame the people who came up and implemented the system as well as anybody who thinks it is a good idea or that they deserve these handouts.

Tribulation

ceebeeby wrote: »

I'm biased to the answer to that question as you can probably tell by the way I've posed the question.

DD2 came home quite miffed last night. It would appear that the majority of the people in her year receive £30 per week for turning up at school, and will be receiving £150 at Christmas as a bonus!

I read somewhere that the principal behind this was to encourage low earning families to allow their children to continue into higher education.

The reality as she lives and sees it is that many (granted not all) of these children obtained poor GSCE results, and instead of now fighting between themselves for the little available unskilled jobs, are sitting in classrooms still flinging bits of paper around, and not really studying at all. Therefore diluting the education standards for those that WANT to be there.

We don't have £30 per week to give to her to make her financially equal. Yet, we're well above the maximum threshold for eligibility.

I'm sure there's an element of jealousy on her part, as in her words, they've all got the latest phones, trendy clothes, go to the chip shop at lunch time, smoke and buy booze ... (not that I'm advocating her doing the latter btw!!) whereas her phone's 2 years old, she wears clothes from primark and makes her own packed lunch. However, don't get me wrong, if someone offered her this money on a plate, she'd take it too - and I'm sure she'd blow any princials about it away!

But what about the the overall ethos behind it.

Something here smacks to me of somehow encouraging children to be low earners / non-workers, because it brings you additional financial reward.

IMHO, and from my personal tax-payers perspective I think it's a joke - but then that's because I'm quite anti-benefits (there are exceptions before you flame me!)

Has anyone a really positive story to tell of this EMA to balance up my so far fairly negative view of it!

I think you are being unfair. I agree the EMA system is a joke but to suggest those that receive it are under achievers is simply not true, it's simply based on how much a family earns.

My daughter qualified for the top rate EMA, came top of her school for her History GCSE and was one of about 6 people in her entire year that was going on to study History, Advanced Maths, English lit etc.

At their school leaving day, 99.9% of those going to college were taking psychology, sociology art etc. Not knocking people who want to study those things, I was just alarmed at how few were studying anything else which begs the question

bestpud wrote: »

If EMA gets even a few of those into reasonable jobs, where they become tax payers and pay their way in life, then it is worth it, don't you think?

How many reasonable jobs will there be for what appears to be over 90%+ of kids (was at my daughters school) that are going to college to study those 3 subjects? Those jobs that are available will have the wages driven right down as the supply will outstrip demand.


Most the people in her advanced maths class and her English Lit class etc qualified for EMA. It has nothing to do with how bad people were at school.

But, I think the whole EMA system is a joke. Either give it to everyone or no one.

For every one person that really needs it, there are probably 10000 that don't. And some of those that do need it will have parents that don't qualify.

My daughter lived about 600 yrds from her college but qualified for full EMA. She didn't need it at all, neither did any of her friends except one. This one guy had to travel miles on buses etc but as his parents earned so much, he wasn't entitled to any EMA, even though his parents had such a high mortgage, they couldn't afford to give him the money.

Hence, he (and the others that didn't qualify) are out in the evenings working in Tesco etc to pay for their needed travel while my daughter and her fiends are sitting at home chatting on facebook, saving her EMA up so that every 3 weeks she could travel to Wales and see her boyfriend.

I am 100% convinced EMA is the reason most never bothered looking for work. Thankfully, 1/2 way through her final year at college, we finally managed to talk sense into my daughter and she did get a job at McDonalds.

I wanted her to experience real hard work before she went to Uni and graduated (have witnessed too many graduates in my lifetime who have never done any menial work at all and think they are better than everyone else, I wanted my daughter to realise this wasn't true)

Other things that are stupid with EMA is that different teachers/colleges apply the rules differently. Some people get it stopped temporarily if they are constantly late etc. My daughter is the worst time keeper on the planet, was always late for her first lesson and NEVER lost any EMA

Personally I think it should be abolished and those that need help with travel (living over x amount away) should get a free bus pass regardless of their parents earnings.

student_advisor

I'm definitely not going to sit here and say that EMA is perfect - I am well aware that it is not.

However, I would like to try and dispel this myth that all students on EMA are underachievers, lazy and just putting off a life of JSA.

I work with young people. Every day I see students who simply would not be able to attend college without EMA. I watch them go through 2 or 3 years with us and move on to a job or university.

I do see students who should get it but don't, whose parents can't afford to support them in the same way.

I also see students who blatantly don't need it and clearly wouldn't be "studying" if it weren't for EMA.

Like most financial systems, it is open to abuse. There are groups that miss out. There are students and families that are treated unfairly. But there are the ones that need it and to whom it makes a significant difference.

Some of the money could be better spent, maybe a review of EMA alongside other FE funding such as local authority transport policies (not even going to get started about those) would be a good idea but would we actually get something better out the other end?

littlepinkstars44

I recieved EMA while in 6th year a school, and at college the year after.
Almost everyone in my year got it 5th and 6th year in school, i couldn't as i wasn't 16 yet (birthday in january) So couldn't even leave school when the majority of them did.
I didn't exactly need it, as i had a part time job, and made £300 a week from that. But it did come in handy though, as we used to get it every 2nd week. So we'd get £60 on the monday and go into town after school and blow it all at once.

Lokolo

littlepinkstars44 wrote: »

I recieved EMA while in 6th year a school, and at college the year after.
Almost everyone in my year got it 5th and 6th year in school, i couldn't as i wasn't 16 yet (birthday in january) So couldn't even leave school when the majority of them did.
I didn't exactly need it, as i had a part time job, and made £300 a week from that. But it did come in handy though, as we used to get it every 2nd week. So we'd get £60 on the monday and go into town after school and blow it all at once.

My thoughts exactly! No-one needs the money. Thats what part time jobs are there for.

However, no-one is going to refuse free money to blow in town :rotfl:

bumpoowee

student_advisor wrote: »

I work with young people. Every day I see students who simply would not be able to attend college without EMA.

Please explain. I got no contribution from my parents yet attended college. I got a part time job - give me one good reason these poor excuses for students give for not being able to attend without EMA?

If they can't get a job aged 16-17 why the hell should the huge tax contributions I make be used to put them through further education (not that they couldn't get through further education without it)? Chances are they will still be unemployable when they come out of FE.

Humphrey10

I really don't understand what EMA is for, if it's not just a bribe to get people to stay on at school.

I (and my parents) didn't pay anything eg fees to the school, there were no travel costs (even if I hadn't gone to that school there were two others in walking distance. I'm sure there are 16-18 year olds without a school in walking/cycling distance but I can't believe it's common), and I really don't know what all these 'course materials' are that people keep going on about. Some pens and paper don't cost £30 a week. Textbooks etc were provided from the school. So what's the EMA for?

student_advisor

bumpoowee wrote: »

Please explain. I got no contribution from my parents yet attended college. I got a part time job - give me one good reason these poor excuses for students give for not being able to attend without EMA?

If they can't get a job aged 16-17 why the hell should the huge tax contributions I make be used to put them through further education (not that they couldn't get through further education without it)? Chances are they will still be unemployable when they come out of FE.

I work with young people who are homeless, who live independently, who are parents themselves, who are carers for their parents, who are unable to manage both part-time work and full-time study due to disability. Who are working hard to improve their chances.

I also work with young people who live in extremely rural areas where there is little work, or it costs so much to travel to work that it means it's not cost-effective on minimum wage.

There are students who fall through the holes in our local authority transport policies and have to pay ridiculous sums of money for travel to college.

The young people I work with are not "poor excuses for students". I find it very offensive that you say so. They are hard-working and eager to take their lives and education forward despite the s*@! hand that they have been dealt with.

student_advisor

littlepinkstars44 wrote: »

I had a part time job, and made £300 a week from that.

You had a part-time job that paid £15,600 pa while you were a student? What were you doing?