Bank charges

ltlmiles5

Some people are in financial difficulty due to sudden job losses, and with hefty bank charges for every time you go over by a little, that doesn't help - just aggravates matters.

My mother-in-law at one point, had no money even to buy food, when she found another job at last, but her salary was going into her bank account, and her bank wouldn' let her withdraw anything till her charges were paid! This went on for a few weeks. All this time, she had to get money for petrol to continue her job, and food. We had to withdraw from our credit card to help her buy food as we have negligible savings.

Charges are fine,but they have got to be reasonable, and not make desperate people even more worse off. That is just morally wrong.

I have just opened an account with A&L as well. I went over my limit by a few pounds due to a direct debit that goes through once every 3 months, and they slapped on £30 charge (I think, or £25). I phoned to complain and they refunded 1\2 as a gesture of goodwill.

however, that month was a bad month, and that made me worse off! Then, I noticed when I checked online that a cheque I'd paid in hadn't cleared yet, and I was over my limit by £18. that morning, before 10 am, I put some money in and was assured by the CSA that I shoudl be OK, as it was still before 10 am.

Guess what? Greedy A&L still slapped on the £30 charge. Phoned to complain, as it was the same day, and they said no, as my account would have gone overdrawn in the early hours of the morning, even before 10 am! They refunded 1/2 my money charged, but I still think very badly of their money grabbing behaviour. I have advised my mothe-in-law to try and claim all her charges back over the last 5 years, but to open a new account elsewhere first. I might try and do the same, but luckily I've only been charged about twice so far.

The Financial Watchdog should tighten the noose around the banks' necks. Profit is one thing, but greed at the expense of ordinary hardworking people, is another.

IvanOpinion

ltlmiles5 wrote:

The Financial Watchdog should tighten the noose around the banks' necks. Profit is one thing, but greed at the expense of ordinary hardworking people, is another.

I work in IT and while I am not involved directly in the project, there are several of my colleagues 'investigating' alternatives based on one bank realising things are about to change. Having talked to some of them about what they are doing the thing that is common is that the 'costs' are going to remain but since it is thought that they can no longer be applied to those that have actually incurred them it is possible that they may soon be spread across all customers. I am also seeing similar concepts being utilised in other industries.

Therefore all those customers attempting to run their accounts responsibly and keep them in credit are going to be penalised to cover the charges for those with a more cavalier attitude towards their balances... is that fair? Forget about banks making large profits .. that is going to remain (to ensure the shareholders are happy), its just that everybody will be contributing more towards them.

Ivan

andydixon

Ther are a coupl of points Ivan if the banks knew their charges were fair they would not refund when challenged. They would fight their corner in court. They will not because they know both ther charges and terms and conditions breach legislation. Secondly because most people accept what happens to the the banks continue to do what they want. If they start to charge everyone to cover the losses elsewhere it will be challenged by people like me and guess what I bet they refund. - Andy

andydixon

oh and one other point Ivan, it is not bout the right of the bank to impose charges, it is the level at which they pitch them. As someone above mentioned I don't deliberately go over but my life circumstances, beyond my control put me in dire straits for a while. the banks high charges, several hundred pounds a month for several months, made it a damn site worse and made it harder to recover. if they were right they would not have refunded me a four figure sum and paid me a sum in damages, If you willingly pay high bank charges when you go wrong then you might as well flush your hard earned money down the toilet- andy

IvanOpinion

... except that in the future instead of the people breaking the T&C paying for it we ALL will effectively be flushing our money down the toilet .. its just that it will be 'hidden' in various strange and obscure manners.

Marketing people are becoming very very adept at making the dumb public think they are getting something whereas if you step back you realise they are taking something away. I have seen it happen many times within various market sectors (I can't believe that some people fall for the 'special offers' .. maybe it is a case there is one born every minute). The same strategies used there will be applied to banking.

The best one I was involved in was the public calling for blood over a possible 12% price hike with our dumb media doing its usual sensationalism ... the problem we had though was that the target hike was not 12%, it was actually 18%. In the end we managed to get a 20% price hike thinly veiled by marketing as a 10% hike (because most people are too stupid to read the small print) and our dumb media was patting itself on the back over how they protected the public ... everybody was happy (and we got a big bonus).

Nobody willingly pays bank charges .. however people are going to have to understand that either everybody pays a little bit extra to cover other peoples mistakes or those that incur the charges pay for their own .. that is the choice .. marketing this to the dumb public and putting the relevant products in place is probably going to be the easy part. However it does not make it fair!

Somebodies life circumstances are irrelevant to a bank or any other company that you deal with... all they are interested in is getting in the money YOU agreed to pay as part of the contract (whether or not the contract is fair). The first thing anybody should do if they run into difficulty is contact their creditors and work out a payment plan (preferably with the help of CAB etc.) .. NEVER EVER try to bury the debt thinking it will go away .. it won't.

Ivan

LondonDiva

:TWell said Ivan:T

I am fed up that there is a growing culture of thinking it's ok to get into debt without paying it off. In most cases, a discussion with the bank can lead to penalties or interest being suspended. In the end, the bank does not force you to borrow money which is what going into overdraft is.

I have every sympathy if you go into overdraft and are in difficulties, but feel it is very unfair that I will eventually have to cover those who are unable to keep to their ts&cs.

If you hate the big bank charges, move to a smaller bank or somewhere else that offers the convinience and is prepared to give a £3000 overdraft without covering the costs of lending the money.

moonrakerz

IvanOpinion wrote:

...

T
Nobody willingly pays bank charges ..
Ivan

That is where I think you are wrong Ivan - I think everone would happily pay a reasonable fee for a service that they are being provided with - be it from the plumber, a solicitor or a bank. As I have said before whether people are too lazy, stupid, tired, broke or whatever, to make payments on time to a bank is TOTALLY IRRELEVANT - these so called "charges" are unlawful and the T & Cs the banks try and impose on their customers are also extremely doubtful.
If Comet fail to deliver your new fridge at the agreed time and you took the day off work to be there, you can't slap a £500 "charge" on them, ONLY if you can prove that was your actual financial loss. This is just what the banks are doing to their customers, claiming that it is in their T & Cs is "unfair" in Law.
Why do you think the banks are paying up and not going to court to fight it out? - beacause they know they would lose. their only (again doubtful) course of action at the moment is to close peoples accounts.

You state - "I have paid penalty charges a couple of times and the amazing and common factor was that I broke the contract." Yes, no problem with that but the Law (NOT ME !) says that the most that the bank can charge you is the actual financial loss they incurred, now if you think that was £30 or whatever they fleeced you for .........................FINE.

Finally you state: "credit is a privilege, NOT a right!" Do you really beleive that ?? The banks will give credit to just about anyone - they want you to get into debt, they want you to owe them money, the more the better ! They want you to get into financial trouble, miss a few payments then they can rook you even more at £30 a trick.
I am utterly amazed by the advertising on daytime television enticing people into more and more debt. There is one on at the moment where a man is shown with a huge "DEBT", shown in letters bigger that he is, the company offers to lend him more money than he already owes, and at the end of the ad he can hold his "debt" in his hand.

Why do you seem to condone the unlawful actions of the banks, would you condone someone stealing your neighbour's car, and say it's his own stupid fault, just because they didn't steal yours ?

elisebutt65

I think there are some letters on the Consumer Adction Group site that you can send to your bank, if they try and close your account.

But basically before you start any of this action - you should open a 'parachute' account if they do pull the plug. I opened a basic account at the Woolwich the same day I sent off my letter to Shabbey asking for my list of charges or statements.

They're dragging their feet at the minute - they have until Tuesday to send me the rest of my statements - only sent me a years worth so far - then I'll take them to court using last years to estimate the rest - £750/per annum for 6 years

ltlmiles5

[
If Comet fail to deliver your new fridge at the agreed time and you took the day off work to be there, you can't slap a £500 "charge" on them, ONLY if you can prove that was your actual financial loss. This is just what the banks are doing to their customers, claiming that it is in their T & Cs is "unfair" in Law.


well stated,Moonrakerz. At the end of the day, it is about being fair and trading fairly. I don't mind being charged a little if I have made a mistake, but not a huge sum for a few pounds!

My husband's Natwest account automatically gives him a buffer zone and doesn't charge if he goes over the limit only by a few pounds, or just for a few days. He thought A&L's charges were astronomical and ridiculous, which of course, they are. Not to mention, it also takes ages for any cheques or electronic payments to clear there. I think after my 12 months interest free overdraft is up, I'll switch back to First Direct. They're more sensible there.

Incidentally, when I was in A&L a few weeks back, a woman was complaining loudly about her bank charges, saying that she wasn't going to work so hard just for nothing. While the cashier went to the back to see if there was anything she could do, I quickly informed the lady of this site, and that she could claim her money back over the last 5 years. She was grateful for this information and I certainly hope that it helps her.

ltlmiles5

Therefore all those customers attempting to run their accounts responsibly and keep them in credit are going to be penalised to cover the charges for those with a more cavalier attitude towards their balances... is that fair? Forget about banks making large profits .. that is going to remain (to ensure the shareholders are happy), its just that everybody will be contributing more towards them.

Ivan[/QUOTE]

Wouldn't it be fairer to have a sliding scale of charges according to the amount actually overdrawn and the time period spent being overdrawn?

Also, to send the customer an e-mail, text message or letter informing that no money can be taken out as the account has reached say £50 over its limit, and charging for the cost of the letter, perhaps, only a few pounds, or free e-mail and text message alert. Instead of letting customers get more overdrawn, and charging more and makign it worse.