Migrants to UK 'returning home'

MissMoneypenny

Really2 wrote: »

To be fair the reason a few of us questioned it was because you said.

True:D


But as people seemed to think we needed a high birth rate to keep the elderly, I was pointing out that that arguement finished a decade ago when many new child related benefits came in.

If you look at the same link I gave, for the childcare costs for WTC

"There are limits on the weekly costs you can claim. If you pay childcare for:

• one child, the maximum you can claim is £175 a week
• two or more children, the maximum is £300 a week"

The parent won't be paying that much tax into the pot every week.


As PN said, these children too will need taking care of in their old age.

Unless the obesity epidemic gets them first.

inspector_monkfish

Any wrote: »

Where did you get that from? It's really funny... and in many cases so true.. :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

Errmm.. i got it from the daily mash

loads of equally hilarious stories on there if you have time to scroll through them

http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/war/guilty%3a-the-!!!!!-who-made-airports-even-worse-200909082040/

Really2

MissMoneypenny wrote: »

True:D


But as people seemed to think we needed a high birth rate to keep the elderly, I was pointing out that that arguement finished a decade ago when many new child related benefits came in.

I think it shows we need young people, women to go back to work and people being paid to look after children just to support the current situation.

There can be no doubt an ageing population will be a burden, incentavising child birth and going back to work I think emphasises, not disproves it.

But that's just how I see it.

MissMoneypenny

ninky wrote: »

i've looking into getting a student visa for my brother-in-law. the points seem fairly straightforward to me. you need to prove evidence of adequate funds for your time in the UK to the institutions involved. what's the problem with that?

Nothing, if they are genuine students. If you look on the immigration boards, there are bogus colleges set up to get student visas and then there are those who apply for a student visa, but don't attend their course. They are in breach of their visas.

The same with family visas where they then don't go home again.

Unfortunately, the bogus claims are making it hard for genuine cases. Which is unfair, but I don't see a way around that. It's the same for most countries.

IveSeenTheLight

MissMoneypenny wrote: »

As PN said, these children too will need taking care of in their old age.

See, this is where I think it could be changed,

I agree there is far to many benefits paid out, however I think those that simply don't want to work or falsly claim disability benefits are far worse than trying to get parents back into work.

You say that new children will "need" taking care of in the future, but there are decades to try and sort that out.

Maybe through education and a change in the system it could happen.

Maybe it's wishful thinking though.

ruggedtoast

ninky wrote: »

i've looking into getting a student visa for my brother-in-law. the points seem fairly straightforward to me. you need to prove evidence of adequate funds for your time in the UK to the institutions involved. what's the problem with that? UK students apply to go and study overseas all the time too. giving someone a student visa is not the same as giving them citizenship or permanent resident status. likewise, employers can only grant visas for certain positions and in certain cases to non EU immigrants.

You need to show a bank statement that belongs to a family member showing recent evidence of funds.

Previously it had to be your bank statement and the funds had to be there for some months demonstrating genuine solvency.

Anyone studying more than 6 months officially has no recourse to public funds. However they do get free unlimited NHS care, the right to work part time during term, full time in the holidays and an automatic two year working visa once their course has finished.

Not a bad deal considering you can still get on a full time course for £4000 a year in some places.

carolt

MissMoneypenny wrote: »

True:D


But as people seemed to think we needed a high birth rate to keep the elderly, I was pointing out that that arguement finished a decade ago when many new child related benefits came in.

If you look at the same link I gave, for the childcare costs for WTC

"There are limits on the weekly costs you can claim. If you pay childcare for:

• one child, the maximum you can claim is £175 a week
• two or more children, the maximum is £300 a week"

The parent won't be paying that much tax into the pot every week.

You can only claim that much if you earn next to nothing. Most working parents I know don't claim anything from that - the amount is reduced the more you earn, so that none of that or pennies is actually available to most working parents.

Everyone gets child benefit - but at £10-13/week per child, it's not exactly going to match your tax input unless you earn next to nothing and have a dozen children.

Likewise, child tax credit pays something like £500/year to all those earning over the threshold of something like 23K, up to 60K - again, you'd have to be pretty badly paid for that to match what you pay in tax.

Quick back of the envelope calculation - Child Tax Credit plus child benefit for average 2 adult, 2 child family = c £1,700 annually - not bad. But to be paying £1,700 or less in tax - ie be in profit, after receiving these benefits, you'd need to be earning less than £12,000 a year - not many couples with kids that applies to.

The childcare help is only available to those where both parents work- highly unlikely they'd both be working and yet still pay lesss in tax than they were receiving.

carolt

Also interesting to compare current children's benefits with the Married Couples' Allowance it replaced. If that still applied, the same couple (assuming they were married), where the woman didn't work and use her allowance, would gain c £2,500 for a higher rate tax payer, or £1,200 for a lower rate taxpayer.

ninky_2

MissMoneypenny wrote: »

Nothing, if they are genuine students. If you look on the immigration boards, there are bogus colleges set up to get student visas and then there are those who apply for a student visa, but don't attend their course. They are in breach of their visas.

The same with family visas where they then don't go home again.

Unfortunately, the bogus claims are making it hard for genuine cases. Which is unfair, but I don't see a way around that. It's the same for most countries.

i'm pretty sure this has been clamped down on now.

as for family visas where they don't go home, you can't penalise the genuine for fear of the so-called bogus. to me it is actually in breach of human rights to stop people visiting family members - which is effectively what the current system often does. if people then don't go home again it's up to the law to catch them. we don't ban everyone from driving 'in case' they speed, or everyone from drinking 'in case' they drink drive. why should immigration be any different to other offences?

ninky_2

ruggedtoast wrote: »

You need to show a bank statement that belongs to a family member showing recent evidence of funds.

Previously it had to be your bank statement and the funds had to be there for some months demonstrating genuine solvency.

Anyone studying more than 6 months officially has no recourse to public funds. However they do get free unlimited NHS care, the right to work part time during term, full time in the holidays and an automatic two year working visa once their course has finished.

Not a bad deal considering you can still get on a full time course for £4000 a year in some places.

well why shouldn't a family member sponsor you if they want to? this is exactly what i was intending to do for my brother-in-law (who has no chance of saving the money himself). it seems people are all very willing to feel sorry for pictures of deprived in other countries but when it comes to actually helping people to have a better life they are unwilling to make any sort of sacrifice to their own standard of living or show any kindness or help.

brits get these sort of rights when they go to study overseas - do you think they should be stopped too?