Ebuyer wants a refund

barns_wallis

Recently I sold A Union Flag I started the bidding at £5.00 & £4.00p&p.

Hear is my advert

A vintage cut and stitched cotton (not printed) Union Jack flag. I was told it dated to around 1914 it feels like it’s made of wool. It’s in good condition for an item of this age and type. Please remember that this is a cut and stitched flag, not a printed one. This flag is full of character with genuine signs of age and colours gently muted by time. A wonderfully nostalgic piece from a time long since gone…
Measurements: aprox
Length 68 inches
[FONT=&quot]Width 35 inches[/FONT]


Shortly after it was listed i had an email asking for aditional information photographs of any damage marks etc. i took clear close up pics of any marks and damage and sent them with the email explaining about what was in the pics they wher so clear you could see the weaving and stitching. he said he was happy with the pics so he would bid. (I did notice that he had no feedback and had only been a member of ebay just over one week.) Anyway he did bid and won the item for £56.00 so i packed it up carfully as it is old and sent it the next day and left him good feedback for paying so quick via paypal. Three days later I recived this email



Hello,
the Union Jack flag that I'd just bought off you has arrived and I have to say I'm very dissapointed with it. For one, it's no way near the age you described it as and secondly, its absolutley filthy on the left hand side. I'd like to return it to you with a full refund please.


I sent an email back
Dear Sir
The reason I did not respond to your emails is that I work all week and the only chance I have to answer is at the weekend.

I am very sorry to hear that you are disappointed with your purchase. I try my hardest to satisfy all my buyers as you can see I have good feedback so until now I have hade no complaints.

Firstly eBay as you know is an auction site therefore you set the price you wish to pay for an item (you are not forced to bid on an item if you do not wish to)

The item started at £5.00 the bidders push up the price you can stop your bidding at any point in the auction. The fact that the item went so high is that the item was in a lot of demand.

The item was described to the best of my knowledge you in particular where furnished with extra photographs and information the other bidders did not have. I did not say anything in the description that would mislead anyone. You being the bidder must make up your own mind to buy or not based on the information given.

1)You said the flag is no where near the age I said. I said “I was told it dated to around 1914 it feels like it is made of wool”. I know nothing about flags only what the old man who sold it to me said some time ago.
2)You said the flag is absolutely filthy. I said. “This flag is full of character with genuine signs of age and colours gently muted by time”.
3)The bidder that lost to you bided up to £55.00 if you where unsure you should not have out bided him. He is a collector of flags and he would probably appreciate it more.

As I said earlier eBay is an auction site, and just as in an auction carried out at Christies etc you cannot expect to hand back the item and get your money back unless the item description and photographs where grossly misleading. And it was not.
I am sorry you feel the way you do but I do not give refunds on items I sell. If you do not wish to keep the flag just re list it on eBay as I did and get your money back
A copy of this email will be sent to eBay



Now he as started a despute via paypal. Does anyone have any ideas I think he is in the wrong

shellsuit

I think you've been very honest and fair and have to say your email to him explains things very well.

I think he is in the wrong too, especially as you had given him extra information and pictures of the flag.

Fingers crossed he won't win the dispute ~ please update us!

NickyBo_2

You sound like you were very honest with your description, especially as you sent him additional photos of any markings. He sounds like he is very new to Ebay and hasn't read the rules yet!

Good luck with the dispute

viktory

Personally I would refund and relist. From what I gather, he will win the dispute he has started via Paypal and you'll have no choice but to refund.

It's not right and not fair but that is the downside of Ebay.

steviebabes

Paypal will decide in his favour and ask him to send the item back for a refund. They do not have the staff to study every claim so this is nearly always the outcome of a SNAD dispute.

cyberbob

As others have said you will probably loose the SNAD. These are very difficult to defend against. You would have been better off telling the buyer to return the item for a full refund other than them going through Paypal. The fact that they have had to go through a dispute means that they are likely to leave you a Negative. If you are a low volume seller this could seriously effect your search standings.


I am not saying who is right or wrong but looking at your replies to him you probably could have given a better description

barns_wallis wrote: »

1)You said the flag is no where near the age I said. I said “I was told it dated to around 1914 it feels like it is made of wool”. I know nothing about flags only what the old man who sold it to me said some time ago.

If you know nothing about flags why quote an age you cannot backup?

barns_wallis wrote: »

2)You said the flag is absolutely filthy. I said. “This flag is full of character with genuine signs of age and colours gently muted by time”.

Dirt is dirt you can't hide it with Semantics. Thats estate agent speak

barns_wallis wrote: »

A copy of this email will be sent to eBay

Ebay won't really care

I do think your description could have been a lot better. Quoting something that you cannot back up like the age is a big mistake. Also the fact that you had to email him extra photos may point to you not having enough good quality detailed photos in your listing.

I'm afraid your surmise that ebay is like an auction house is wrong. In a normal auction house you can get to view the items before hand.

I am not saying that he is in the right but reading your listing and your responses you could have minimised this possibility a lot more. As I said earlier the buyer will win the cliam

ellielou_2

Hi
I'm having the same problem with an item I sold recently. The buyer has put in a dispute which basically makes up problems with the item I sold, I actually think the buyer has caused some of the problems myself by washing the item several times!!!

However, as the seller I cannot comment on the case as paypal haven't given me the opportunity, only the chance to give them photos of the item. I have offered to refund the full cost of the item, if the item is returned in the condition I sent it in at her cost, but I refuse to refund the £11 postage fee.

I'd already withdrawn the funds from my account so they have basically taken the money from me already so my paypal balance is in debit.
From what I read they will side with the seller & I will be £40 out of pocket.

Oh and paypal will have lost a good customer, as I use their services often for ebay - where incedentally I have a 100% feedback & 5/5 for item descriptions.

Gggggrrrrrr!!!!

iamestelle

I sell quite a lot on Ebay and it can be quite unnerving and intimidating to receive this kind of complaint about something you've taken time to list. It makes you feel as though you've tried to con someone when you've just been as honest as possible. However in my experience it really isn't worth the stress of taking this further, I would give them a refund and relist, add the extra photos that you've taken, block this awkward person from buying from you and send second chance offers to the previous bidders. This person obviously doesn't have a genuine interest in a piece that has historical value and the flag would be better going to home that appreciates it anyway : )

Smart_But_Casual

I really don't understand why people get their knickers in a twist about issues like this.

Yes, none of us like it but we all know that we are unlikely to win a SNAD dispute so it's quicker and easier just to get them to return the item, refund them and then relist.

It's really not worth losing sleep over IMHO.

frivolous_fay

cyberbob wrote: »

Dirt is dirt you can't hide it with Semantics. Thats estate agent speak

I agree. You shouldn't have to read between the lines to understand that 'muted by time' means 'dirty'!

MsCrow

Just to clarify, not all SNAD claims are won by the buyer. I sold a vintage perfume collection where I described the scuffs and scratches on the plastic box in the auction. The buyer tried a SNAD complaining about this particular issue. I responded to the paypal claim reiterating the auction wording and paypal dismissed her claim. You could restate the facts in the paypal claim response and stick to your guns. You may however feel happier receiving the flag back first and refunding (I didn't as the collection had been sold to Malaysia) then offering to the under bidder or relisting.