City taken by surprise as Bank of England’s figures herald end of recession

bendix

I'm sorry Rochdale. I simply can't read your stuff because it comes from such a one-dimensional initial premise (Labour good, Tories bad) that every post just blurs into one.

I'm sure you have a lot to say, but it's all so freaking tedious. Sorry.

Rochdale_Pioneers

bendix wrote: »

I'm sorry Rochdale. I simply can't read your stuff because it comes from such a one-dimensional initial premise (Labour good, Tories bad) that every post just blurs into one.

I'm sure you have a lot to say, but it's all so freaking tedious. Sorry.

If you'd read the above you'd see that I said Labour plus pretty much every other government and political party across the globe, Tories bad on the response to the economy.

Sorry if the facts bore you. The Tories were in fact on their own - not supported by other right of centre governments or parties or a phalanx of economists, noone. Thats not me being partisan, thats just what happened.

purch

We then saw the Lawson recession where they were happy to spend billions on the fire of political expediency keeping the £ at an unsustainable level against the DM

.........but his Budget speeches were by far the most entertaining and suspense filled..........especially the long one's as he got progressively more and more 'sozzled' :eek:

Thrugelmir

If you'd read the above you'd see that I said Labour plus pretty much every other government

The point is. The UK has its own very specfic issues. The electorate want to know why even during the boom years. The huge tax revenues that were generated by the very banks that created the problem has disappeared without trace. The Treasury coffers are empty.

Why are we (like Ireland and the US ) going to suffer the most?

Talking Global is past. The time for UK specific is now.

whathavewedone

Even if we are officially out of recession before the year is out I don't think it will feel that way by the next General Election.

If you cast your mind back to 1997 the economy was well on the road to recovery but it didn't help the tories back then and I don't think it will help labour in 2010.

There are a couple of good articles on Political Betting over the last couple of days - one saying that labour's problem is more about politics than the economy and another saying that labour have had it easy for the last 10 years - basically all they've had to say is we're not the nasty tories and that's been enough.

For me the economy is only one of a whole bunch of reasons not to vote labour.

Of course labour party members are going to hope that a recovering economy will save them from electoral defeat. You can't blame Rochdale for trying.

Thrugelmir

whathavewedone wrote: »

Even if we are officially out of recession before the year is out I don't think it will feel that way by the next General Election.

If you cast your mind back to 1997 the economy was well on the road to recovery but it didn't help the tories back then and I don't think it will help labour in 2010.

There are a couple of good articles on Political Betting over the last couple of days - one saying that labour's problem is more about politics than the economy and another saying that labour have had it easy for the last 10 years - basically all they've had to say is we're not the nasty tories and that's been enough.

For me the economy is only one of a whole bunch of reasons not to vote labour.

Of course labour party members are going to hope that a recovering economy will save them from electoral defeat. You can't blame Rochdale for trying.

What some people want. Is the truth and action. Not endless spin and sound bites.

Politics in itself needs a major overhaul.

We need top business people in the Industry ministry for a start. Medical people in health. People who understand the issues in the widest sense.

bendix

Rochdale_Pioneers wrote: »

If you'd read the above you'd see that I said Labour plus pretty much every other government and political party across the globe, Tories bad on the response to the economy.

Sorry if the facts bore you. The Tories were in fact on their own - not supported by other right of centre governments or parties or a phalanx of economists, noone. Thats not me being partisan, thats just what happened.

Yes, yes, yes. That's right. As I thought. Labour good, Tories bad. Ad nauseum, ad infinito.

There really is no need for you to precis your posts. We know at the start of it what the end will be.

How about surprising us sometime? Instead, it's put the coin in the slot and out comes the usual verbiage.

Rochdale_Pioneers

whathavewedone wrote: »

Of course labour party members are going to hope that a recovering economy will save them from electoral defeat. You can't blame Rochdale for trying.

Whilst there is no such thing as a dead cert in politics and I expect the polls to swing back, I don't expect Labour to win. Regardless of that I want economic recovery now. Here, Germany, France, wherever. Recessions damage people's lives, only a cretin plays politics with that. Political boost for Labour or for the Tories - whatever - we need the Uk recession to be over as quickly as possible.

bendix wrote:

There really is no need for you to precis your posts. We know at the start of it what the end will be.

How about surprising us sometime?

How about telling me where I have stated something which doesn't fit the facts? Am I politically slanted? Yes I am. Does that change the facts that I have set out regarding political support for the Tory position on fiscal stimuli? No it doesn't.

The funny thing about politics is that aside from the spin and the ideology there are also little things called facts and the history books. Support whoever you like - the facts don't change, just the relative importance you think they hold and what difference you think come as a result of them. Me being Labour doesn't change the fact that interest rates under the Tories were 10%+ for most of the 80s. Nor does it change the fact that Labour genuinely did bankrupt us in the mid 70s. Sometimes a spade is a spade, regardless of what colour you think it should be painted.

bendix

Rochdale, could I give you some advice? Read Karl Popper. He will teach you that the best way to progress intellectually is to develop your theory (in your case Labour Good, Tory Bad etc etc) and then actively seek to attack it and find evidence to break it down. If it survives, then the theory becomes stronger. It never becomes the truth, but it gets closer to it.

The intellectually weak, however, come up with a viewpoint and then spend the rest of their lives interested only in 'facts' which support their view.

Which camp do you fit in?

whathavewedone

It's all the labour party seem to be able to do at the moment. If you look on blogs like Labourlist, article after article is the same old stuff about how awful the tories are. If you go on Conservativehome you find people discussing conservative party policy.

I hope labour carry on like this. I remember how successful the "New Labour New Danger" campaign was for the tories in 1997.

All we've had over the last few weeks have been one attempted smear after another. The old Coulson business ramped like mad by the BBC and the Guardian being just one example. Now they are trying to make people believe that because a conservative MEP has very different views from Cameron on the NHS that it's the MEP that represents the "real" tory view about the NHS.

Many people are stupid but most are not that stupid.

Meanwhile, people are dying of illnesses like meningitis because doctors won't see them and they're being diagnosed without being tested. The government advisor on Swine Flu is a director of the company that makes Tamiflu.

As for Afghanistan...