Neil Morrisey in Millions of £'s of debt due to Property Investment Collapse!!

never-in-doubt

dfh wrote: »

Yes,you have to give him credit for that.He has not gone around looking for loopholes !

Loopholes? Don't you mean law?

A loophole is trying to find something that is wrong (that isn't obvious at the time) whereas the basis of unenforceability is credited to law, no agreement (or unlawful agreement) means BY LAW the debt is unenforceable.

No loophole in that, black and white enough to me

never-in-doubt

leveller2911 wrote: »

I couldn't agree more Graham, when you read through the posts most(not all) are personal bankrupts , there are people on there who,s life,s work is finding errors and mistakes in loan agreements purely to get the agreements un-enforced.Morals do NOT play any part in their thinking.

No, thats looking for loopholes. Unenforceability is quite clear cut as detailed above.

Morals do not matter in a court of law for the tenth time!

leveller2911 wrote: »

Generally speaking few if any accept responsability for their own actions, to them the blame lies solely at the door of the lenders for " lending money we couldn't afford to pay back.

Exactly and quite rightly as well. The lenders never take responsibility do they - they are 100% to blame.

leveller2911 wrote: »

They are so blinkered it really is unreal over there.

You mean in the same places I hang out where you tried to come and preach and got set straight?

leveller2911 wrote: »

Ive posted on there and all you get is abuse and total denial of the arguement.I've never seen so much congratulating it gets a bit sickly after a while.

You certainly do not get abused (are we a branch of Barclays all of a sudden?) We never asked for you to come in with your 'incorrect' tuppence worth - stay out if it makes you feel unwell.

leveller2911

Thrugelmir wrote: »

However people arrive at the point of bankruptcy. For many the effects will linger on for years. As it affects not only credit rating, but job prospects etc. A flash car or expensive holiday is soon forgotten. When its back to catching buses or no holidays at all. Peoples memories are short. That's when it will hit home.

Looking at people that were careful with their money. Retiring early with their mortgages paid off. Having a comfortable lifestyle. Once an opportunity is lost. Such as earning power. It rarely can be recovered. Life's too short for that.

The blame for the culture and the lending on the never never has to rest with the regulators. Human nature is always to find loop holes or make the most of every opportunity.

Whilst the money gets written off. Somebody else will pick up the tab and pay the cost. Nothing is for free. In the case of credit cards the 20% - 30% interest rates reflect the risk of the lending. Those in jobs with homes will continue to pay their debts till to the day they die.

Agree with most of that Thrug, but you using "human nature" as an excuse not to pay, I dont agree, the vast majority of people do pay so it can't be an excuse.
"The blame for the culture of lending on the never never has to rest with the regulators" at what point do we as humans take responsability? ive yet to see anyone being "frog marched" into the local NAT WEST and forced to borrow.....
I respect and agree with most of your post Thrug, but not the above.;)
There are people on here (they know who they are) who hate governments interferring with our lives and yet at the same time blame the banks and regulators for NOT regulating......

never-in-doubt

leveller2911 wrote: »

ive yet to see anyone being "frog marched" into the local NAT WEST and forced to borrow.....
.;)

"I was in debt with Natwest and they told me that I had to consolidate my cards and bank account into a managed loan".

"HSBC forced me to take a managed loan"

"Abbey told me if I never took their loan that they would take my house"

Some examples of a quick google search...... force does not necessarily mean to frog-march but can be emotive instead.

leveller2911

never-in-doubt wrote: »

"I was in debt with Natwest and they told me that I had to consolidate my cards and bank account into a managed loan".

"HSBC forced me to take a managed loan"

"Abbey told me if I never took their loan that they would take my house"

Some examples of a quick google search...... force does not necessarily mean to frog-march but can be emotive instead.

Flip side of the same coin :

I earn £13k a year, have 7 credit cards all maxed out, unsecured loans of £40k (£27k for a Subaru impreza wrx and £13k on a speed boat) but its not my fault ,Its the banks because they said "YES"........
The FACT is theyre all to blame..............

HO-HUM here we go again...... i'm off to bed , will let you chew that one over NID

never-in-doubt

leveller2911 wrote: »

Flip side of the same coin :

I earn £13k a year, have 7 credit cards all maxed out, unsecured loans of £40k (£27k for a Subaru impreza wrx and £13k on a speed boat) but its not my fault ,Its the banks because they said "YES"........
The FACT is theyre all to blame..............

HO-HUM here we go again...... i'm off to bed , will let you chew that one over NID

No - on that one I will agree with you. :beer:

never-in-doubt

leveller2911 wrote: »

There are people on here (they know who they are) who hate governments interferring with our lives and yet at the same time blame the banks and regulators for NOT regulating......

Nice piece of editing there Leveller :rotfl::rotfl:

Just name me - it's fine!

bendix

Pobby wrote: »

Yes bendix, you are minted so it`s easy for you to cast down those that are forced into bankruptcy. I have already talked about the the last 10 years of a dream world. An house price boom which has hit levels that can only be seen as stupid. Wage inflation going nowhere. Again, not everyone has gone out and bought the flash car, holiday or tv. It`s bout relationship breakdowns, illness or some other bad experience.

There are some that lived high on the hog that didn`t factor in the consequence, agreed. However, get off your high horse and see things as they are.

And as i have said dozens of times on here, Pobby, I feel empathy for those who have been forced into bankruptcy through things like illness.

Go and spend some time in the BR forum. You will see that the vast majority of threads are done by those who have got into the mess completely of their own free will.

lemonjelly

lostinrates wrote: »

Sounds likea good deterrant to not bother trying to build yourself up again if depressed (Iwould be if I were bankrupt) and starting from scratch.Would only''work'' with a full overhaul of the benefit system.

I think the best way to prevent it is tighter controls in advance of debt, not after it.

Very good post & point LIR. Agree with you completely. The most vulnerable would suffer.

Thrugelmir wrote: »

However people arrive at the point of bankruptcy. For many the effects will linger on for years. As it affects not only credit rating, but job prospects etc. A flash car or expensive holiday is soon forgotten. When its back to catching buses or no holidays at all. Peoples memories are short. That's when it will hit home.

Looking at people that were careful with their money. Retiring early with their mortgages paid off. Having a comfortable lifestyle. Once an opportunity is lost. Such as earning power. It rarely can be recovered. Life's too short for that.

The blame for the culture and the lending on the never never has to rest with the regulators. Human nature is always to find loop holes or make the most of every opportunity.

Whilst the money gets written off. Somebody else will pick up the tab and pay the cost. Nothing is for free. In the case of credit cards the 20% - 30% interest rates reflect the risk of the lending. Those in jobs with homes will continue to pay their debts till to the day they die.

Agree with this too. Dippychick has made good points that many who go BR haven't really thought out the costs & consequences of the outcome. The future implications on employment, access to credit, mortgages and the like. To me it is another example of our "here & now" culture. We're only interested in the here & now, want it, need it, gotta have it.

Thing is, people have been allowed to go down such a route.

Interestingly, following on from a discussion on another thread recently, it is interested that both parties (lenders & borrowers) decline to accept the responsibility for the debt. Both push any blame onto the other party.

Thing is, our credit laws are well overdue an overhaul. The main one (Consumer Credit Act) was passed in 1974! Thats 35 years ago! How different is the credit market now compared to then? And if it came into force in 1974, then it was written in the preceeding years.

The mortgage market saw increases in regulation through the 90's. It really, really is time for the unsecured lending market to undergo a thorough review, including more regulation which would illuminate more the responsibilities that both sides have to each other when they enter into their contractual relationship together, and I would argue updating relevant legislation like the current Consumer Credit Act.