how can you avoid house u own paying for nursing home fees

[Deleted User]

uberalles wrote: »

The point is that people lead their lives differently in many ways. Those who are careful and value and save what they earn should not have it taken just because they are unable to look after themselves and the government see it as fair game that the money should be theirs.
Whereas others who were in younger life carefree, get the same for nothing.

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by a basic service I actually mean BASIC ie keeping body alive but certainly not in a place I would ever want to be in ie mixing with all sorts and sharing their facilities. Living in the stench of urine etc etc. That tbh would feel like payback time to those who had squandered their money. Like I said, if we ever need care then we shall go for luxury care ie single room, en suite, freshly cooked meals and so on. With lots of good quality care and attention and with like minded intelligent people

To that end we have already saved the money for best care for at least two years. It is in inflation proofed ns%i certs and will roll over year on year without tax. Add on the extra 1% every year and in 30 years or so that amount will cover considerably more than two years. By then the country will hardly be able to afford even the most basic care for the masses and there might be dormitory-like conditions. Who knows

Re the costs, did you see Bigg`s room last night? Clean and basic with an en suite at a cost of £3200 pm so £3600-£4000 looks the norm for an A1 home

I have just been doing my sums and we can fund 51 months of the very best carehome just in ns&i certs and that is not accounting for growth which I know has been considerable. I thank my lucky stars that we didn`t squander or go on luxury holidays and that we run a little skoda. Our care is now SAFE and it is far far better than insurance. We started them almost 5 years ago and I bought them every time I could. My neighbour bought a holiday home in spain, I bought the certs

marklv

MissMoneypenny wrote: »

I'm not sure where the extra money will come from to pay for all of that though marklv.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/5651825/Benefit-payouts-will-exceed-income-tax-revenue.html

"Treasury figures show that welfare payments will exceed income tax receipts by almost £25 billion. Normally, income tax receipts comfortably cover the benefits bill."

"In 2009/10, the Treasury is expecting to take in £140.5 billion in gross income tax receipts. Social security benefits are projected to be £164.7 billion."

"This year will be the first in a decade that benefits cost more than workers pay in income tax."

"As well as spending more on welfare, the Government is facing rising bills for the interest on the growing national debt, which is set to hit £1.4 trillion in five years."

"Mervyn King, the Bank of England governor, warned that whoever wins the next election will have no choice but to cut spending and raise taxes in order to reduce the "extraordinary" deficit Labour has run up."

Simple. The government has been lacking in courage - it is simply afraid to tax the rich adequately and close tax loopholes that allow billionaires to pay virtually no tax. In the meantime, ordinary people are taxed to death.

margaretclare

kittie wrote: »

of course not re food but by basic I would think sharing a room and toilet etc would be fine. I would expect food to be ok but not gourmet.

Sharing a room and toilet would NOT be fine. Think 'going on holiday'. We don't stay at the Ritz, but we always ask for certain things - a double bed, an en suite bathroom with walk-in shower. Sharing toilet etc belongs to the old days of seaside boarding-houses - it's gone, unlamented.

Sharing a toilet is fine when you live in the kind of intimacy accepted in a normal marriage. Sharing with a complete stranger day in day out, and one that you hadn't chosen to share with, whose habits may be very different from yours - no, I wouldn't want that.

As for food, I'd want some choice there also. We have a lady who comes to our church, has to leave early because lunch is served at midday and if she's not there, she'd miss it. An extra half-hour to attend a church service? Not a criminal offence, is it?

[Deleted User]

that was tongue in cheek Margaret. By free being fine I meant as applied to basic free care for the scroungiers

MissMoneypenny

margaretclare wrote: »

Sharing a toilet is fine when you live in the kind of intimacy accepted in a normal marriage. Sharing with a complete stranger day in day out, and one that you hadn't chosen to share with, whose habits may be very different from yours - no, I wouldn't want that.

Lots of care homes have shared toilets and bathrooms. Even some of the private paid for homes have shared bathrooms, if they are a converted house type care home.

At one purpose built care home I visited, the downstairs was for the state paid for patients, with a very small basic room, shared bathroom facilites and a lounge/dinning room with other state paid for patients and those who screamed a lot. The private patients that didn't scream, had their own lounge/dinning room and could get wine with their meals. Their bedrooms were upstairs, bigger and had en suites to every room.

That's why I suggested to the OP that he and his parents looked at the difference between state paid for and private paid for homes, before his parents gave away their home to avoid fees. That money could make a big difference to their quality of life in their final years.

I forgot to say that the private lounge had patio doors leading out onto a beautiful garden. The state paid for patients could use this garden (if they could walk), but they couldn't see it from their lounge.

marklv

I don't think sharing a toilet and/or bathroom is a big issue, unless you are a multi-millionaire and only want the best. However, sharing a bedroom is certainly not acceptable - everyone needs their private space.

margaretclare

marklv wrote: »

I don't think sharing a toilet and/or bathroom is a big issue, unless you are a multi-millionaire and only want the best. However, sharing a bedroom is certainly not acceptable - everyone needs their private space.

It would be a big issue with me. We're not multi-millionaires - I pointed out that we don't stay at the Ritz - but we do ask for en suite facilities when we go away.

I didn't grow up this way - we didn't even have a bathroom and the loo was in the back yard. However, we live differently nowadays an expectations are different.

Torry_Quine

MissMoneypenny wrote: »

I assume that is weekly? Which works out to £962pcm, plus the 2k your relative was paying, three years ago. It looks like 3k -4k is about the norm for nursing homes then.

Yes, that's weekly

marklv wrote: »

I don't think sharing a toilet and/or bathroom is a big issue, unless you are a multi-millionaire and only want the best. However, sharing a bedroom is certainly not acceptable - everyone needs their private space.

It is a big issue as without too much information old people's toilet habits can be problematic at the best of times! For instance one person may be up to the toilet multiple times in the night therby disturbing the other occupant.

Modern care home standards are for single en-suite rooms so thankfully the days of sharing should soon be behind us.

MissMoneypenny

Torry_Quine wrote: »

Yes, that's weekly
It is a big issue as without too much information old people's toilet habits can be problematic at the best of times! For instance one person may be up to the toilet multiple times in the night therby disturbing the other occupant.

At the modern home I mentioned above, it would be occupants. The rooms all came off a corrider and every so often there was a toilet or bathroom. The lounge/dinning room was next to one of those toilets, so it would have been used a lot during the day as most residents were brought into the lounge.

marklv

margaretclare wrote: »

It would be a big issue with me. We're not multi-millionaires - I pointed out that we don't stay at the Ritz - but we do ask for en suite facilities when we go away.

I didn't grow up this way - we didn't even have a bathroom and the loo was in the back yard. However, we live differently nowadays an expectations are different.

Fair enough, I feel the same way as you, but when you are 85+ and infirm enough to be in a nursing home, you probably need assistance to go to the loo anyway, so it doesn't really matter. What's the point of having an ensuite bathroom when you need someone to help you in and out and clean your behind? A nursing home is not a hotel - not by any stretch of imagination - it's more of a long term hospital. I believe the word 'hospice' was used in the past, but I guess this has become politically incorrect.

You need to have realistic expectations - and this is why such a place should be an absolute last resort for anyone. If someone can continue to live at home, with the assistance of social services and the NHS, so much the better.