Are Paypal acting illegally?

Smart_But_Casual

At best it appears to be a grey area.

As a seller, if I sell a faulty item, I refund the postage ONCE I get the item back and only then.

I'm not sure how paypal can do owt else if I'm honest and believe me, I'm no lover of paypal.

It is up to the seller to refund your money and not paypal and whilst I hope you win your case, I don't believe you will.

soolin

You are in exactly the same situation that you would be in for any online company, paypal can only refund you what they are holding on your behalf, ie the original payment. If under law you are entitled to a return postage cost as well then you would need to use the law against the seller, not paypal.

Assuming the seller is in the UK and is a bsuiness (that makes it a little easier) you can go via small claims court for the costs of returning the item.

Tubby_Hubby

Premier wrote: »

I can assure you trading standards won't be interested in a few cases you advise them of of other buyers not being refunded their postage costrs by the seller


They are? Be sure to let us know when they find in your favour wont you?
In fact I'm sure it'll be on the national news if you ever do.
Somehow I can't seeing it being on the BBC news anytime soon though :cool:

So feel free to let us know when the Financial Ombudsman Service contacts you to explain why they believe Paypal have treated you fairly instead

Whatever your problem is I hope you now feel better... or clever... or whatever it is you're trying to achieve. Post what you like now I'm not going to bother responding I came on here asking for advice and information I don't want or need your sarcasm.

TurkishDelight

Was it a buy it now? Or a auction with a return policy? By default the seller should by law refund you the cost of returning the item, (only on a buy it now) but if they state that they won't before you purchase it then they don't have to. Realistically though I don't see how you could chase it even if they didn't bother stating it.

RFW

Tubby_Hubby wrote: »

I've haven't asked Paypal to refund the postage, I expect the seller to do this. I asked Paypal to refund the purchase price and ask the seller to arrange for collection of the item or pay for the return postage costs. I don't expect Paypal to refund me more than I paid but I don't expect to be out of pocket either. I also believe that Paypal are guilty of failing to use common sense, the seller posts the item by standard mail and I am expected to pay around £5 to return it by recorded delivery

In that case not sure why you think Paypal have acted illegally, why should they refund you before you have returned the item? Paypal require all sellers to send goods by trackable means (and for returning goods too) some sellers choose not to do so. You are free to send the goods not tracked and hope that the seller will admit to receiving them. Paypal are only advising you for your own security.

You have two real choices, you can return the item recorded delivery (which should only cost 75p more than the seller paid) as advised and then forward acknowledgement of receipt to Paypal and receive the refund, then chase the seller for the £5 additional postage (which you are unlikely ever to get back, unless you go to court which is more expense for you that you may or may not get back).

Second option is to contact the seller and demand they pay for the return, if they don't (which as you say they said they won't), you would have to go to Trading Standards and ask them to pursue it on your behalf and a few months down the line you'll probably get your £5 postage and a refund from the seller.

Tubby_Hubby

Was it a buy it now? Or a auction with a return policy? By default the seller should by law refund you the cost of returning the item

Yes it was

In that case not sure why you think Paypal have acted illegally, why should they refund you before you have returned the item? Paypal require all sellers to send goods by trackable means (and for returning goods too) some sellers choose not to do so. You are free to send the goods not tracked and hope that the seller will admit to receiving them. Paypal are only advising you for your own security.

I think Paypals terms and conditions could be illegal. The Sale of Goods Act specifically requires sellers to pay for return postage if goods are faulty, thefore their terms and conditions don't comply with the Sale of Goods Act and may well be a breach of unfair terms and conditions legislation. I am not expecting Paypal to pay for the postage, what I expected was for them to enforce the law and advise the seller that he must cover the postage costs.

Smart_But_Casual

Tubby_Hubby wrote: »

Yes it was



I think Paypals terms and conditions could be illegal. The Sale of Goods Act specifically requires sellers to pay for return postage if goods are faulty, thefore their terms and conditions don't comply with the Sale of Goods Act and may well be a breach of unfair terms and conditions legislation. I am not expecting Paypal to pay for the postage, what I expected was for them to enforce the law and advise the seller that he must cover the postage costs.

I really do think you are barking up the wrong tree here.

Paypal haven't sold you the item and they have no moral or legal obligation to enforce the seller to pay you in advance for a return.

The seller is in the wrong here and should be the subject of your annoyance and not paypal.

RFW

Tubby_Hubby wrote: »

Yes it was



I think Paypals terms and conditions could be illegal. The Sale of Goods Act specifically requires sellers to pay for return postage if goods are faulty, thefore their terms and conditions don't comply with the Sale of Goods Act and may well be a breach of unfair terms and conditions legislation. I am not expecting Paypal to pay for the postage, what I expected was for them to enforce the law and advise the seller that he must cover the postage costs.

Then you are incorrect. You haven't purchased anything from Paypal so they don't have to comply with the Sale of Goods Act. I'm certain that if this was the case they would have been asked to comply by now, you would not be the first person to come across such a situation.
How do you expect Paypal to 'enforce the law'?

TurkishDelight

Tubby_Hubby wrote: »

Yes it was

Did it say that you would get your return postage back? I'm having a little trouble finding the DSRs at the moment (I'm sure I've got them saved somewhere. ) but this a quote from ebays guidance:

You must refund the original delivery charges. However, you are permitted to require the buyer to pay for the cost of returning the item, but only if you clearly inform the buyer of this before the contract is made.

smashed

Tubby_Hubby wrote: »

Whatever your problem is I hope you now feel better... or clever... or whatever it is you're trying to achieve. Post what you like now I'm not going to bother responding I came on here asking for advice and information I don't want or need your sarcasm.

People are offering you advice but you dont seem to want to listen unless its an answer that you want to hear.
As others have said..
Yes, there is a legal obligation from the seller to refund the return postage on a faulty item. It is in the DSR's.
The seller is NOT paypal and NOT ebay. Therefore, you cannot chase them for this money.
Yes, Paypal / Ebay may have rules that buyers and sellers have adhered to and no this does not override UK law but...
Paypal do not have to force the seller to refund the return postage, they are not the police.
Your dispute is with the seller, and you should be chasing this person for a refund. Legally, the seller should refund you (ideally within 30 days) even if you have yet to return the item. (though he can try to reclaim from you via the courts too)