Ex leaving Scotland for Finland

Honest_broker07

I think to be honest if he's abroad and he's "proved" to the CSA he has no income (which is how he's got a £0 assessment), you'll be throwing good money after bad chasing him.

PlayingHardball

Honest_broker07 wrote: »

I think to be honest if he's abroad and he's "proved" to the CSA he has no income (which is how he's got a £0 assessment), you'll be throwing good money after bad chasing him.

NO! this is rubbish from someone who is not in your situation, sorry honest broker, but you are not qualified to say this! My ex is 'proved to the CSA to have no income yet he provides a very wealthy lifestyle, 2 homes that he owns, another he lets, you cannot adivse the OP this way, surely!!! If you can, please tell us of your experience with regard to a NRP who lives abroad, it is a minefield! I would not give up, personally.

Does your ex own any property in the UK

AnxiousMum

With REMO, he won't have to attend court here, and you won't have to attend court there - the courts here will have a hearing which you attend with all your evidence, they then issue a provisional order. This order is then sent BY THE COURTS to the courts in the reciprocating country, where he then appears. The court there then makes a decision as to whether they feel the order is fair and in accordance with what they can enforce. Your ex gets to defend his position and present his case. All being good, the Finnish court then makes an order based on the provisional order from the UK, or makes a new order that once registered there in court, is enforceable. I'm now at the 'enforceable' stage with my ex in Canada - it's so much better than dealing with CSA - when you go to court you get to actually appear in person with the people making a very important decision. The ex gets the same right to appear in court in person there - no being fobbed off in telephone, claims of not receiving paperwork etc.

PlayingHardball

Hi Anxious, I think you are right with the CSA versus REMO and getting 'your day in court', however, I'm REALLY looking forward to my tribunal hearing, where I'll get to have a voice, hopefully. There has been far too many mistakes at the CSA level, so I'm thankful for tribunals. (she says before attending one!)

Gailo

Ugh, just back from solicitor, who showed us an email she'd just got from ex. Despite us spending months trying to get him to provide even the most basic details and support for our son, he declared that I had been trying to arrange maintenance in a way that was not official. He has phoned the CSA once in the past year, on the same day he emailed the solicitor, and has not so much as spoken to my son since August. He refused to provide a phone number, or support, but all of a sudden, I am the bad guy, who wants to be paid in an unofficial way, whatever that means. My solicitor grinned, as we've been trying for over 8 months to put in place any kind of agreement, firstly a private one, then more official and he has ignored any and all communication.
The solicitor still wants to try and get an agreement before we try for a court order, but have such a nasty taste in my mouth from all this.
This man is adamant that he does not have to pay for anything for the past 8 months as he has had no income, he couldn't claim benefit in Finland, obviously, since he's not a Finnish citizen, but still sent us documents from the Finnish benefits system anyway, in Finnish, to prove he wasn't getting money from them. Anyone with common sense would know this to be the case.
He has no property left in the UK, he sold everything prior to flitting, so had the funds from that and his girlfriend to live off, will that come up if we go to court?
I would honestly never have anything to do with the CSA again. Their enforcement options for parents who don't pay are a joke, loopholes that idiots can exploit.
Am heartened that there are other parents out there with similar scenarios, am keen to see what REMO can do if we have to draft them in. Have no doubts that even if we manage to sort out some kind of schedule, he'll wiggle out of it like he has in the past, by disappearing like he did this time last year, or getting paid cash in hand.
I think I'll just ignore your advice Honest Broker...we may have to pay, and get stressed, but my son is only 8 so needs support from both sides, it's the law and if I have to keep tearing my hair out to ensure this happens, then I will.

PlayingHardball

Hi Gailo,
You started this thread back in July 09 and many suggested REMO to you back then. I'm curious to know why you didn't go down that route, and what you feel a solicitor can do for you? I really think REMO is your only option, and the sooner you get that rolling the better. And, if nothing else, doesn't the solicitor cost you for his work?

I'm not sure, but I think it is too late for your solicitor to get a UK court order for maintenance now. That should have been done in July 09 when you knew he was leaving.

At least, that is my understanding of UK court orders. As you don't currently have a UK court order, it is the reciprocal countries job to put this in place in their country. (it just makes things MUCH more difficult for the reciprocal country)

Gailo

We tried to get a court order started last summer, but at that time the CSA dithered and we kept being told the PWC was due to start a job. This job may have been with a British company, so they kept the case open. From that time on he refused to answer calls, or emails, and refused to deal with the CSA, so the CSA kept our case open. Our solicitor told us that because we were at that time getting Legal Aid, she said we had to try to set up a Private Agreement, to show we had exhausted all options before trying court. When I last spoke to the man at REMO in Scotland, he was unsure as to how things would work in Finland, but it seemed using the Scottish system first was more sensible. He also advised we get a solicitor, as we would not be able to lodge an agreement or court order without one.
When we asked for an agreement to be made back in July, we were accused of being over cautious and rushing things.
My ex did make the effort of emailing my solicitor every now and again to say he had not yet started work, so in effect stalled things, as he had no income to assess.
Our solicitor still wants to try and resolve this without using REMO, is this strange? She also didn't mention any time limits, she seemed to suggest that court would remain an option.
He left initially ahead of the time he was meant to, as we did have meetings planned to come to agreements with maintenance, and basically skipped out to avoid them.

PlayingHardball

Gailo wrote: »

Our solicitor still wants to try and resolve this without using REMO, is this strange? She also didn't mention any time limits, she seemed to suggest that court would remain an option.
.

VERY strange! I believe she is wrong, perhaps stringing you along as she's getting a good hourly rate? See below which I took off the Solicitor Generals page on REMO. Finland is definately a REMO country.

2. Seeking an order in a Scottish court (if you do not have an existing one)
If you do not have a court order you may be able to ask the court to make what is called a provisional order if you meet all the requirements. But please get the help of a solicitor for this. A provisional order is an order made here where the payer is abroad (see chapter 6) and did not have the opportunity to defend the action. It cannot be enforced overseas in that form so the court will then forward the provisional order and any other necessary documents to Courts Group. It will then be sent to the relevant foreign authority and will be presented to the court overseas. The payer is given the opportunity to defend the action in the overseas court. The court can either confirm (accept the order as it stands), vary (the amount) or refuse to confirm (reject) the order. You will then be told what the court has decided.


Has your solicitor mentioned this route at all? If not, I'd be livid by now! Take my advice or leave it, but I would be calling the solicitor tomorrow and asking her to apply for a provisional order NOW. You've given the ex more than enough time to come to a private agreement.

This is not an easy solution and it may take you years to get anywhere. But at least by applying you know you've done the best by your child to secure some type of financial input from his father.

PlayingHardball

Some contact details for REMO offices which may be helpful:

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/library2/doc05/omfa-08.htm