Confusing Reduancy situation

RubyRue

Hi

My other half recieved a letter on Friday saying that he and two others were at risk of redundancy. They are saying that there is 3 working days for consultation, starting that Friday (19th June) and that if he has any suggestion of alternatives or questions to ring them (he is currently signed off sick for 4 weeks).

He rang up one of the directors yesterday (Monday) who told him they were currently looking at other jobs for him to do in the company and to come in this coming Friday to chat about it.

Now a letter went round the company yesterday (the other half hasn't recieved it being that he is off sick) saying that himself and the other two are leaving the company.

I thought that if he was being made redudant they had to consult with him, make the decision, then offer an appeal? It sounds as if they have made the decision already.

I was wondering what your thoughts are about the situation?

Many thanks

Pete111

Oh dear. They have rather jumped the gun.

Ensure your OH goes to the meeting on Friday prepared to bring this up as it could legitimately be argued that a decision has been made prior to consultation being concluded (or really starting to be honest - 3 working days is very short). As such the company has most likely breached at least part of the process.

Once he has been formally made redundant he could appeal on this basis with a view to getting an enhanced settlement

However, be aware that the company may be in a position to offer him another role (he will probably find this out on Friday) As such he may want to see what is on the table before making a fuss.

Good luck

RubyRue

Thanks for the reply. We've managed to get a hold of a copy of the letter (it hasn't officially been sent to him yet) but it was given out to everyone in the company yesterday in a meeting. It says there are going to be no further reduancies and that OH will be leaving and wishes him well. Nice!

Pete111

Wow that is daft - especially as the company did appear to have some understanding of redundancy process having set up a consultation (albeit a very brief one)

You never announce redundancies before confirming these formally to the individual and ending the consultation . That's just asking for trouble.

As before, see what is said at the meeting but its sounds to me as though there is very little intention of offering a new role to your OH - as such you wll need to consider next steps including the option to appeal

P

bendix

The company has made a massive employment law error here and as Pete says, it's weird in that they did seem to have some understanding of the process.

If the letter in question does in fact state they are leaving (sometimes people read meaning into words that don't exist, especially at difficult times) then the OP's hubby has a bona fide claim here and it could cost the company significantly.

RubyRue

bendix wrote: »

If the letter in question does in fact state they are leaving (sometimes people read meaning into words that don't exist.

Hi thanks for your reply.

The exact words in the letter obviously changing names is

"Mrs X, Mrs Y and O/H are all leaving us and I would like to thank them for their hard work and help"

The letter is dated the 22nd June 2009. The rest goes on saying that everyone might be aware of the changes made in the recent weeks and is writing to inform everyone of the current position. The changes they have made should ensure the financial security of the company etc etc and thanks everyone for their support in these difficult times.

The at risk of redudancy letter OH recieved was dated the 19th June, giving three working days consultation commencing on the 19th. OH didn't actually recieve that letter until the evening of the 19th.

What is even wierder is that apprently they did consult some HR people before doing all this, they obviously didn't listen to what they were supposed to do.

Pete111

I hope for the sake of the HR bods that Mgt misheard them or ignored their counsel. If HR advised them to do a public announcement of the redundancies 1 day into a formal consultation then they may find themselves looking for work shortly...

As Bendix says they have cocked up hugely here. I think you may do rather well out of an appeal focussing on a complete failure to consult despite starting a formal process (which I think is actually helpful to your cause as they can't try to claim ignorance of procedure) . Don't forget to throw in something re the sheer inappropriateness of everyone else being formally told before those being made redundant were informed ... they are absolutely barmy!

P

bendix

Pete is right. In some ways, they couldnt have handled it worse. Some tribunals have been known to give some companies a bit of leeway when it's obvious they had no idea of the formal process, but in this instance they obviously know what the right thing to do is, started to pay lip service to doing it, and then revealed that the process was - from their perspective - a sham.

I'd advise your OH to lawyer up.

bendix

RubyRue wrote: »

Hi thanks for your reply.

The exact words in the letter obviously changing names is

"Mrs X, Mrs Y and O/H are all leaving us and I would like to thank them for their hard work and help"

The letter is dated the 22nd June 2009. The rest goes on saying that everyone might be aware of the changes made in the recent weeks and is writing to inform everyone of the current position. The changes they have made should ensure the financial security of the company etc etc and thanks everyone for their support in these difficult times.

The at risk of redudancy letter OH recieved was dated the 19th June, giving three working days consultation commencing on the 19th. OH didn't actually recieve that letter until the evening of the 19th.

What is even wierder is that apprently they did consult some HR people before doing all this, they obviously didn't listen to what they were supposed to do.

Thanks. The letter is pretty clear and unequivocal.

Apologies if you thought I was implying you had read it wrong, but I know how sometimes rather vague letters can be misinterpreted. That is definitely not the case there.

As I said already, lawyer up!

RubyRue

Thanks for all your replies, no problem whatsoever Bendix I know what you mean about some letters being ambiguous!

They made another employee redundant a few months ago so it's not like this is the first time they are doing it and are unsure of the procedures. OH is still in contact with him so might be an idea for him to find out if they followed the procedures correctly that time.

How do you think he should play the meeting on Friday? Should he bring up the errors they are making or let them hang themselves?

I'm a member of Unison, unfortunately he doesn't have a union in his workplace, but I think he might qualify for legal assistance through my membership, will have to check!

RubyRue

Actually I've just found out that the previous employee that was made redundant didn't even get a formal at risk letter and wasn't consultated at all, he was just called into a meeting and told he was off. They then didn't tell him what his redundancy package was until a few weeks later despite having giving him an end date. Since then they called in the HR bods to find out how to do it.