Help tenant being awkward paying

tbs624

You got an accidental thanks there Chriswish MSE would shift the quote and thanks buttons to opposite sides

Chris2685 wrote: »

. If the LL is paying the mortgage (or at least paying towards it) with the rent, then what right do you have to not pay at the agreed time?

The T is merely obliged to pay rent by the due date under the contract terms: the LLs personal finances are not the Ts problem.

Chris2685

tbs624 wrote: »

The T is merely obliged to pay rent by the due date under the contract terms: the LLs personal finances are not the Ts problem.

Did I say otherwise?

kazbabe

Thank you all for your advise.

I am trying to get in touch with the tenant to have a face to face conversation and she makes arrangements and then breaks them every time it gets close to it. My husband has even popped round there on the off chance someone is home and no one answers the door.
I understand that she should have quiet enjoyment, but how else am i suppose to contact the tenant if she wont reply to anything. We dont bother her at any other time, unless she rings for something which she never does. The heating had gone wrong in the property but she left it for 3 weeks until the next lot of rent was due and we contacted her to go and collect it!!!!!
The son is named on the tenancy agreement as he is 19 yrs old. I do believe he doesn't know. As before when she was short the other month she told me he knows nothing about it.
She gets paid monthly as I know she works for the government in the CSA. Although she pays me cash because she says its easier and she is unable to do direct debits or standing orders!!!
I do have a small back up but i do not want to touch this unless i really really have to.

kazbabe

She knows nothing about my finances and I will not tell her about my finances, but I am sure that many others are in my position when they rent their second homes out.

Do you give your LL so many excuses or things that change the times for when rent is collected?? maybe some arent excuses but when i am supposed to be collecting the rent surely you should be there when you say you are. I have had 2 weeks of this already and this is not the first time. I never had this problem with my first tenant, and maybe im new to the situation but I'm sorry I also have a young family to think of.

There are times when I wish I had never started renting and been able to sell my property!!!

furndire

Is it possible that she is now out of work, and waiting for housing benefit to come through - in which case it can take weeks - around here its about 8 weeks.
This happened to one of our tenants - who eventually left, but had been managing to borrow money from his sister (who actually rented the house from us instead). Some people tend to stick their heads in the sand and think you are a mind reader.
I hope you get sorted quickly -as she certainly seems to be avoiding you.

barnaby-bear

Chris2685 wrote: »

So you admit it yourself, it is not nice to not be paid... If the LL is paying the mortgage (or at least paying towards it) with the rent, then what right do you have to not pay at the agreed time?

Legally in housing law the tenant has every right to stay in the property even if they have a problem paying the rent (sometimes there is a bank transfer error/unemployment/payroll mess up - and we really don't want LLs changing the locks and slinging people with kiddies etc onto the street because the rent is delayed a day or two)... For significant arrears (more than two months the LL can seek possession).... this is one of the risks and overheads of any business if a creditor has credit issues and problems paying a bill, its factored into the overheads, risk model etc of the business.....

Chris2685

barnaby-bear wrote: »

Legally in housing law the tenant has every right to stay in the property even if they have a problem paying the rent (sometimes there is a bank transfer error/unemployment/payroll mess up - and we really don't want LLs changing the locks and slinging people with kiddies etc onto the street because the rent is delayed a day or two)... For significant arrears (more than two months the LL can seek possession).... this is one of the risks and overheads of any business if a creditor has credit issues and problems paying a bill, its factored into the overheads, risk model etc of the business.....

Fair enough, but I still think that morally a tenant should make every effort they can to meet payments, and if they can't then they should at least have a good reason, such as those that you stated in your example above.

The OP of this topic has already said that the tenant has not given a good or clear reason for the late payments.

I am just viewing it from both sides of the fence. If I couldn't meet the payment due to some financial troubles my end, of course I would try and speak civilly with my LL to delay payments. However, I equally understand that the LL has financial commitments themselves and do not deserve to be screwed around just because you know it's 'within the law' so to speak... Most LL's are real people, not property moguls, so it would do some good for LL's and tenants to be able to deal with each other in a friendly and understanding way on both sides.

That's what I feel anyway, you may not a agree and the law may not agree unless it is over 2 months of non-payment, but there you have it.

kazbabe

Chris im with you, on a lot of things. Yes im a landlord, am trying to be very fair. Im also a mum to 3 with a partner who has his own shop and also has to work to keep that going, otherwise we would be out on the streets ourselves!!!
Im not a nasty person, im also a founder member of a parent group at our local school and a governor!!!
As far as I know she is still in work, she told me she was working late last night, surely if they were awaiting for hb then they would have to inform the ll of the matter?!!! Her son also works full time. I would not sling small kiddies out, these are 2 adults Mum and Son.
I am constantly waiting for text messages to tell me whats happening as she very rarely answer her phone and reply. We have both tried on many occasions to be very civil and helpful. She is already in arrears from a short while back.
Last time she told me that her daughter had it, she managed to pay a small part back but that was it then couldn't pay anymore. This time she has been away etc. but every time i try to make arrangements i feel im being fobbed off all the time.

tbs624

Chris2685 wrote: »

Did I say otherwise?

Erm..........

Chris2685 wrote: »

... If the LL is paying the mortgage (or at least paying towards it) with the rent, then what right do you have to not pay at the agreed time?..

I repeat, the LLs personal funding arrangements are irrelevant to the requirement to pay the rent on time.

tbs624

kazbabe wrote: »

Im not a nasty person, im also a founder member of a parent group at our local school and a governor!!!

It's not about anyone being a "nasty person", but it does create difficulties when amateur "reluctant LLs let property out without doing sufficient research beforehand. The best option is always to join a national LL association or sign up to LandlordLaw - tax deductable membership fees and plenty of good advice, plus reductions on LL insurance premiums.

kazbabe wrote: »

As far as I know she is still in work, she told me she was working late last night, surely if they were awaiting for hb then they would have to inform the ll of the matter?!!!

The LL does *not* have to be "informed of the matter": the T may consent to the LL being informed but has no obligations to do so. Even if the T is still working there may be a partial benefit entitlement.

kazbabe wrote: »

Her son also works full time. I would not sling small kiddies out, these are 2 adults Mum and Son.
I am constantly waiting for text messages to tell me whats happening as she very rarely answer her phone and reply. We have both tried on many occasions to be very civil and helpful. She is already in arrears from a short while back.
Last time she told me that her daughter had it, she managed to pay a small part back but that was it then couldn't pay anymore. This time she has been away etc. but every time i try to make arrangements i feel im being fobbed off all the time.

This is a common error that amateur LLs make: you need a paper trail. Stop turning up on your T's doorstep - tenant harassment is a serious charge and if you have a T who knows the ropes you may receive a lawyers letter or be contacted by the local private sector Tenancy Relations Officer.

Stop texting - this is a *business* relationship around a legal contract and mobile phone texts have no place there. *Write* to the T (and the son if he is signed up to the AST with J&SL) giving them an up to date rent statement, with formal notification that you want the rent payments brought up to date within 7 days.Remind them that failure to pay the rent on time is a breach of their tenancy terms and that you can pursue either or both of them for the full amount due. Send one copy via R Delivery and sen another one via normal post with a standard proof of posting.

Serve a S21 notice, as someone else has already suggested, but make sure that you properly time the service of it and date it correctly. Join the NLA or RLA so that you can learn how to serve notices correctly :alternatively LL Law has kits to help guide you through dealing with rent arrears etc.

If you have any phone calls from either T , write a follow-up letter confirming your understanding of the content of that phone call, and keep copies of all letters.

Unfortunately, when you are letting property you do have to have a contingency fund and there will be occasions when you have to use it: it's all part of the game.