Crunch Time: A crisis that is dividing young and old

staffie1

vivatifosi wrote: »

There's an entitlements calculator at http://www.entitledto.co.uk/. It has recently been updated for the 2009/10 tax year.

Thank you for that vivatifosi :T

Edale

This is highlights another problem that has been created, the benefits system has become so complex and opaque that often the most needy do not claim.

vivatifosi

Edale wrote: »

This is highlights another problem that has been created, the benefits system has become so complex and opaque that often the most needy do not claim.

I think you're right there Edale, and that its not necessarily an age related thing. When a relative of mine suffered an industrial injury that ended her working life it took months to sort out her entitlement, in the meantime she ended up in bankruptcy court. Yet the fact remains that there is a minority who are so good at claiming benefits they can blag virtually anything, know all the loopholes and can make benefits a money-spinner (often illegally). My SiL is a social-worker and she finds it hard to stay on top of what ever changing entitlements there are. If the professionals can't keep track, what hope do those who need to claim have?

Pobby

StevieJ wrote: »

Not exactly rocket science! If you had bought end of 1978 by 1982 RPI had increased by 60% presumably along with your wages and thus devaluing you debt.
Throw in MIRAS and Pob's your uncle

It is not beyond the bounds of possibility that we could see a virtual repeat in the not so distant future.

How right you are. Roughly we went from a joint income £3k a year to nearly £20k in 6 years. Rpi and I went through the ranks, sales rep, manager, director. My wife was in product training for a very large computer manufacturer.

Dithering_Dad

needahome wrote: »

you complain that they were high when you were working, now moan they are too low now that you are retired.

Thats the problem with pensioners, they only care for themselves and ignore the generation coming after them, the generation which will be paying for them!

take higher education, when they went to university they had theirs paid for by the generation in front of them, when the generation behind them came, they said sod it, we are now paying for you!

Whereas you just complain, blaming everyone else but yourself.

I'm the same generation as you, I did the student loan thing (and paid it off as quick as I could by using overtime, bonuses and a 2-nights-a-week bar job. It was to my benefit and I was happy to pay. You have to try and remember that previous generations, especially those who have retired, could not get to University (funded or not), they didn't have the opportunities we've had.

I couldn't get a final salary pension either and invested in a money purchase one instead, it's under my control and has been doing very well thanks over the years. I even managed to put it into a cash fund prior to the crash. I don't have to worry about whether the company my final salary is with goes bust (well, actually I do now because I recently started a new job with an employer that provides a FS pension).

I had a £150k mortgage, it'll soon be under £100k. In a few years it'll be completely gone. It was my choice to buy a house (it's not a human right to own a house) and I had to pay the going rate. I'm beavering away in order to reduce the mortgage, using the skills and education gained, in part, from attending Uni.

I think you need to just get your head down and start slogging instead of sitting around and moaning about how everyone around you is doing well because they 'had it handed to them on a plate'. If you're not doing well in life, especialy in a Western country with all the advantages, then it's your fault, no one else's.

Stop carping on and get working. That's my advice.

StevieJ

Oh BTW, well done Kiko :beer:

Pobby

Hi DD, not seen you around for a while. I broadly agree with you but many now come out of Uni with pretty darn useless degrees. I find it quite funny that as a part time musician, most of my life, there are colleges set up to train people in becoming sound engineers as an example. Fairly fruitless in imho.

There has been a massive change in this country over the last 3 decades. We have moved from a manufacturing base to what as described as a servicing industry. Coupled with the greatest housing boom ever, it`s been a difficult move.

As an older person, it has been hard to accept that annuity rates keep crashing. What should have provided us with 12 to 15k is now a fraction of that value.

I really do feel a lot for you youngsters. It hasn`t been good to get your 20k a year and find you are priced out of a housing market that 10 years ago, on that salary, a property was affordable in many areas. At the same time, please don`t blame us old `uns, we had nothing to do with it.

nickmason

Quick observation about the relative poverty of pensioners - and please accept my apologies for any generalisations in here - it is clear already on this thread that generalisations are causing problems.

If the older generation see that they have only £x coming in, then they will spend less than £x, because they know that they need money for unexpected emergencies. This risk aversion will often go as far as living off nothing but baked beans.

Conversely the younger generation, if they are receiving £y will typically spend more than that. Reasons are legion, but include a sense of being due more, the whole immediate satisfaction thing, a general risk tolerance, confidence that the state will look after them and so on.

Also not every cost is immediately visible. For example heating. Again huge generalisation, but the above attitude means that young are more likely to put on the heating to their need, while the old will not because of the fear of high bills. This is compounded by the ludicrous nature of the £25 extreme weather payment, whereby the eligibility is only clear after about 10 weeks of extreme weather!

So even if £y is less than £x, you might well find pensioners spending less than those on JSA - to the extent that they keep the heating off and so on.

Finally I have never believed anyone who says that they are having trouble spending money, or they don't know what to do with it. I think that that's a cover for generosity from grandparents to their beloved children/grandchildren. If only more of the recipients could see it.

As I say, apologies to all those who feel unfairly slighted by my generalisations - I am sure you are exceptions, and I don't mean to insult.

Edale

nickmason wrote: »

Finally I have never believed anyone who says that they are having trouble spending money, or they don't know what to do with it. I think that that's a cover for generosity from grandparents to their beloved children/grandchildren. If only more of the recipients could see it.

My Grandmother has just had her pensioner tax credit reduced because she has amassed over £6000 in savings purely from her pension/pension credit. Her extended family are all well off and hence don't want her money and she really cannot spend her income faster than it comes in. She is 89 and hence lives a fairly sedate lifestyle but I am telling you she cannot easily spend all her income.

StevieJ

Edale wrote: »

My Grandmother has just had her pensioner tax credit reduced because she has amassed over £6000 in savings purely from her pension/pension credit. Her extended family are all well off and hence don't want her money and she really cannot spend her income faster than it comes in. She is 89 and hence lives a fairly sedate lifestyle but I am telling you she cannot easily spend all her income.

That is an easy one

http://www.nspcc.org.uk/

Glad to be of help