Where do I stand please?

Driftwoodgirl

Last year I purchased a few mini ponies from a stud and spent a lot of money with the lady who ran it. Anyway a couple of months later she said she had a lovely pony I could take on and pay for when I had the money - I'd said to her that I didn't want any more, but agreed when she said I could pay whenever.

Anyway, I have been out of work now for nearly two months and do not have the money to buy this pony.

I have offered to send it back, but she won't take it back. I have offered to put it up for sale and she can make the deal etc and have the money go straight to her - she's said she cannot wait that long as the market is dead.

She is now threatening court action - where do I stand please????

Although this lady runs a stud and produces invoices she has told me she is not registered and the taxman has no idea. Would she be stupid to even go through the court route. I'm not someone who's likely to say much about it, but this woman is starting to get nasty and I cannot do anymore than offer to sell for her or send the pony back.

Any advice please??

bookworm1363

Well, what else is she going to get by taking you to court? You have made 2 reasonable offers and she is refusing both, does she really think a court is going to magic money from you out of thin air?

Stand firm, and put your offers in writing again. Make it clear to her that the threat of court is not going to intimidate you and point out that with no job, the court will take a "pay when you can" contract for a pony as being the lowest of the low in your expenses priority and that with an income and expenditure sheet provided to them, they're unlikely to award her more than £1 a month if that, so to think carefully before she chooses that route.

LinasPilibaitisisbatman

bookworm1363 wrote: »

Well, what else is she going to get by taking you to court? You have made 2 reasonable offers and she is refusing both, does she really think a court is going to magic money from you out of thin air?

Stand firm, and put your offers in writing again. Make it clear to her that the threat of court is not going to intimidate you and point out that with no job, the court will take a "pay when you can" contract for a pony as being the lowest of the low in your expenses priority and that with an income and expenditure sheet provided to them, they're unlikely to award her more than £1 a month if that, so to think carefully before she chooses that route.

What a load of crap.

The OP agreed to buy this pony and is liable for the cost of it. Its unclear what was agreed by payment. If it was "whenever" then the seller is owed the money but its up to the OP when to pay for it.

The OP has no right to send it back or make the seller sell it on.

Best option is for the OP to sell it on and pay the seller

If it went to court the OP would still end up owing the money.

p00hsticks

Driftwoodgirl wrote: »

I have offered to send it back, but she won't take it back. I have offered to put it up for sale and she can make the deal etc and have the money go straight to her - she's said she cannot wait that long as the market is dead.

She is now threatening court action - where do I stand please????

A third option would be to work out what you can afford to pay her a month - even if it's only a token £1. Then write her a letter remnding her that there was an agreement that you would pay for the pony 'as and when you could afford it' (or whatever the agreement was - if you have anything in writing to that effect, so much the better - attach a copy to remind her that that was what was agreed). Say that at present you can only pay £x a month as you are now out of work, and that you will increase your payments if and when your financial circumstances improve and/or you are able to sell the pony.

Keep a copy of the letter you write to her, and start sending her the amount you have said you will pay each month.

phlogeston

LinasPilibaitisisbatman wrote: »

What a load of crap.

Ignore LinasPilibaitisisbatman he/she is just trying a touch of forum baiting.

A doubt that any court would deem your agreement to be a contract as "...pay for [the pony] when I had the money" is so vague.

For a contact to exist, the terms of the contract must be clear.

So the seller has two difficulties,

1) Showing a contract exists,

and if she can overcome this hurdle,

2) Enforcing the payment terms

Payment was required when you can afford it. Well you clearly can't, therefore, payment is not yet due.

Alternatively, you could give her two weeks to take the pony or start billing her for the upkeep! That should shut her up.

Nervous LLB(Hons)

pinkshoes

There's two ways to look at this:

1. You initially refused the pony, but only took it on the agreement you could pay when you could afford it. As you can't afford it, then in theory you should give it back...

2. The pony is still hers. You have been housing and feeding it for several months, of which most stables would charge a fortune for! If she does take it to court, then in theory you could counter claim for the above. There is no contract to show if the pony is on loan to you, or being stabled by you. No money has changed hands, so she can't prove you "bought" it.

LinasPilibaitisisbatman

pinkshoes wrote: »

There's two ways to look at this:

1. You initially refused the pony, but only took it on the agreement you could pay when you could afford it. As you can't afford it, then in theory you should give it back...

2. The pony is still hers. You have been housing and feeding it for several months, of which most stables would charge a fortune for! If she does take it to court, then in theory you could counter claim for the above. There is no contract to show if the pony is on loan to you, or being stabled by you. No money has changed hands, so she can't prove you "bought" it.

1) The OP agreed to take the pony, they cant send it back unless the contract allowed and it doesnt seem to

2) Extremely stupid advice. Firstly it is perjury, secondly if the OP lies whats to stop the seller lying and saying the OP bought it and agreed to pay in say 90 days? I think the courts would be far more likely to believe that someone who had previously purchased pony's, and had the pony purchased it to that of the pony seller with their own facilities to keep them giving it away.

Was an invoice issued OP?

phlogeston

LinasPilibaitisisbatman wrote: »

1) The OP agreed to take the pony, they cant send it back unless the contract allowed and it doesnt seem to

2) Extremely stupid advice. Firstly it is perjury, secondly if the OP lies whats to stop the seller lying and saying the OP bought it and agreed to pay in say 90 days? I think the courts would be far more likely to believe that someone who had previously purchased pony's, and had the pony purchased it to that of the pony seller with their own facilities to keep them giving it away.

Was an invoice issued OP?

Ha, ha ha, ha!

1) What contract? If there is one then the payment terms are clearly "when OP can afford it". As that day may never come, there is no obligation to pay!

2) Perjury. What is the perjury in counter claiming? If there is no contract (which on the facts we have been given, there isn't), the seller does indeed still own the horse and would be liable for any fees for its upkeep.

Extremely stupid advice indeed from LinasPilibaitisisbatman. Definitely trying to engage in some trolling.

LinasPilibaitisisbatman

phlogeston wrote: »

Ha, ha ha, ha!

1) What contract? If there is one then the payment terms are clearly "when OP can afford it". As that day may never come, there is no obligation to pay!

2) Perjury. What is the perjury in counter claiming? If there is no contract (which on the facts we have been given, there isn't), the seller does indeed still own the horse and would be liable for any fees for its upkeep.

Extremely stupid advice indeed from LinasPilibaitisisbatman. Definitely trying to engage in some trolling.

If you had read you would have quite clearly seen another poster encouraging the OP to lie about what was agreed in order to intimidate the seller out of claiming.

The OP took the pony and is liable at some point for the cost, if they cant afford it sell and pay it off.

Not exactly rocket science. The OP seems to want to do nothing at all though which considering they took the animal and kept it for several months is very out of order.

As for the contract, no one knows what was agreed but I somehow doubt a random person was given a pony, a previous relationship existed and now the OP cant pay up they have every intention of screwing over the seller. Something which seems to be rife on this board. It should be renamed consumer fraud, scams and lack of common sense/morals.

bookworm1363

LinasPilibaitisisbatman wrote: »

What a load of crap.

Ah bless. when people start with insult, you just know their argument is not going to improve from there.

The OP agreed to buy this pony and is liable for the cost of it.

That's right. I don't think I said otherwise.

Its unclear what was agreed by payment. If it was "whenever" then the seller is owed the money but its up to the OP when to pay for it.

Which makes enforcement by court action somewhat difficult, wouldn't you say?

The OP has no right to send it back or make the seller sell it on.

She's not "making" the seller do anything, she has offered the option.

Best option is for the OP to sell it on and pay the seller

Which if as the previous owner says "the market is dead" won't make the money materialise any faster. At least if the previous owner is involved (one assumes that as a breeder/seller, she has more contacts than the OP does and therefore a better chance to get a - a sale, b - the right price for it), she will know what is happening.

If it went to court the OP would still end up owing the money.

Maybe.. IF the judge decides that there is in fact a contract formed ("when you can afford it" is not likely to cut much ice, as OP could argue that she STILL can't afford it and she's therefore not in breach of contract. QED). Even if the judge does rule in favour of the previous owner, then what? OP will bring an income and expenditure sheet to the courts, show that on her current income, she can not pay more than £1 a month, as things like rent, electricity, food, funnily enough DO take priority over a pony, and the judge will give her that until the debt is paid off, which could take years.

If the OP then defaults on the payment scheme, the claimant could get a warrant of execution and send in the bailiffs who to satisfy the debt will go for the OP's possessions which have the most value and are not a necessity, and that would be, wait for it.... Yep, you got it, the pony! Talk of an own goal. :rolleyes:

Instead on getting on your moral high horse, maybe you should try looking at it from the point of view of that common sense you seem to worship from afar. :cool:

phlogeston

LinasPilibaitisisbatman wrote: »

If you had read you would have quite clearly seen another poster encouraging the OP to lie about what was agreed in order to intimidate the seller out of claiming.

I have just re-read all the posts and can still find no sign of anyone encouraging the OP to lie. Perhaps you could ellucidate?