Train Penalty Fares - some facts

omelette451

KeithP wrote: »

Actually, its happening the other way round.
The subsidies are being reduced, so there is (should be) a greater incentive to increase the revenue collected.

Well, central government subsidies are being reduced, but where I am the PTE subsidises the local rail network, and seems to have no intention of stopping doing so.

angel00079

It seems that the train operators are putting all the responsiblility on the passengers. There are going to be some occasions where they are short staffed etc but it sometimes seems that there is not a member of staff to purchase a ticket from but there is a ticket inspector.

I am all for catching people that go out of their way to evade paying but instead of ploughing money for inspectors why not give people who want to buy a ticket a more convienent way to do so. There are probably arguements for season tickets and purchasing online etc but these do not fit every situation.

If people have to queue to get a ticket after their journey it is likely to put people off using public transport.

FARE-COP

angel00079 wrote: »

It seems that the train operators are putting all the responsiblility on the passengers. There are going to be some occasions where they are short staffed etc but it sometimes seems that there is not a member of staff to purchase a ticket from but there is a ticket inspector.

I am all for catching people that go out of their way to evade paying but instead of ploughing money for inspectors why not give people who want to buy a ticket a more convienent way to do so. There are probably arguements for season tickets and purchasing online etc but these do not fit every situation.

If people have to queue to get a ticket after their journey it is likely to put people off using public transport.

I am sure that the majority of rail staff actually sympathise with that viewpoint to a great extent. The current round of economies will undoubtedly cost train company jobs and I suppose that means in some cases, getting a ticket might be slower or more difficult, but the point is it will not be impossible.

If we are going to travel by train we know that we need to pay the fare.

The law, not the rail company, puts the emphasis of responsibility on the traveller to pay the fare and that has been the case for some 160 years.

It's worth remembering that if you do get a train without a ticket, you don't get asked for one during your journey and then don't queue to pay at the other end, but walk out, you're not risking a penalty fare if you get stopped.

The offence is 'bilking' or, making off without payment.

If you are caught you are most definitely risking a criminal record and if there was a way that you could have bought a ticket before you caught the train you have an obligation to do so. The same applies if you get asked while you are still on the train.

Lots of letters of complaint to the DfT and the rail company customer relations offices about the poor facilities are the way to make the protest. Not by shouldering all the risk yourselves through opportunist theft.

The system is far from perfect, some people may fall into a trap by not wishing to help themselves, but while the weight of the law is on the train operators side, it just isn't worth the risk.

nungirl

I recently received a penalty fine (On my birthday!) for travelling to a station that does not accept the oyster pay as you go card - even though it accepts oyster season tickets. There are no signs displaying this fact and even though i offered to buy a ticket i was fined. Whilst i understand that it is not the staffs fault i feel it is ridiculously unfair, three other people were also fined within the 10 minutes that i was there. I am currently awaiting a decision on my appeal but just wanted to share with you my own experience.

robt_2

nungirl wrote: »

I recently received a penalty fine (On my birthday!) for travelling to a station that does not accept the oyster pay as you go card - even though it accepts oyster season tickets. There are no signs displaying this fact and even though i offered to buy a ticket i was fined. Whilst i understand that it is not the staffs fault i feel it is ridiculously unfair, three other people were also fined within the 10 minutes that i was there. I am currently awaiting a decision on my appeal but just wanted to share with you my own experience.

I bet there were.

omelette451

robt wrote: »

I bet there were.

And in any case, surely it's in the Ts&Cs accepted when you signed up for Oyster...?

FARE-COP

It certainly is.

nungirl

There were no signs, i used to work on London Underground and having been based at stratford station am well aquainted with it. To further illustrate this point over the last year the overground (Silverlink) line has changed from only accepting oyster season ticket cards to any oyster cards. At Camden Rd station when i arrived prior to this change they allowed me to buy a ticket with no complaint and no mention of a fine.

ruthiejane

What would be the reaction of National Express coaches to a passenger on a coach without a ticket?

Of course it is the passengers responsibility to purchase a valid ticket for the journey being made. None of the ticket machines issue "priv" tickets to which I am entitled, nor is my local travel agency or any website able to issue them. Most of the railway stations in my area are unstaffed. The ONLY places I can buy tickets from are staffed railway station ticket offices, and on board the train if the ticket office is closed/non existant. It is my responsibility to overcome the inconvieniece and purchase a ticket as soon as I am able - either before boarding the train, or to go and find a ticket inspector on board the first train on my journey.

KeithP

But Ruthie, you have an extra incentive to seek out someone who will sell you a super-duper discounted ticket. :beer: