Recently widowed; husband had debts I did not know about

desperate_annie

I’ve had a look through a lot of this thread and haven’t come across anything exactly like my situation yet, and as I’m in a desperate situation decided to start my own message board despite the fact that I’ve never done anything like this before.

My husband of 40 years died at Christmas, a year after a terminal prognosis was given. Only after his death have I discovered that he was in substantial debt, through credit card statements coming in the mail and going through his paperwork.

I feel that I was terribly naïve as my husband handled all our financial affairs, and gave me a cheque every month to cover housekeeping, spends etc which I paid into my own account. However, he worked for many years as a financial manager and I assumed that everything was fine with both our joint bank account (which I did not even have a card for) and with our money situation generally.

I think that I now know the extent of the crisis: 5 credit cards with a total of £31,000 on them, £3,000 overdraft on our joint bank account and a £2,000 loan which has insurance on it, so am hoping that that debt will be written off.
The largest credit card bill is £11,000, the smallest is £1,800.

Looking through his paperwork, I also think that my husband was ill for much longer than I originally thought. He had a secondary brain tumour from lung cancer, which increasingly affected his behaviour, memory, decision making etc.

I simply cannot believe that this is happening to me. As well as the exhaustion after nursing someone and the bereavement and loneliness after 40 years of marriage and having to get used to living on my own, I also have to wade through this quagmire of debts and paperwork.

I think that I have done everything I can so far:
As soon as I found out about the debts, my daughter cancelled all the cards, so the interest has been stopped. They now have copies of the death certificate and I have written to them to say I shall be in touch after meeting with the CAB.
I have an appointment with a debt adviser at CAB on Tuesday 24th with my daughter (we had to wait 3 weeks – I phoned them up as soon as I discovered the debts), and everything I’ve read on the Internet suggests that they are the best people.

However, our solicitor who put together our will (which is useless as my husband did not mention debts at the time, so we only listed assets) has said that there is a real chance that I could lose the house, as this is the only asset in my husband’s estate.
We seem to be getting a lot of conflicting advice about whether this would happen or not.

In terms of my assets, I have approx £6,000 in savings but at the moment only have my state pension and a small employer pension (£35 per month) in terms of income. I am waiting to hear back from my husband’s work pension – I should be entitled to half, which would work out approx £800 per month, but they have said that this could take up to 3 months to sort out.
In the meantime, I have the funeral expenses to find (£3,000) but am also waiting for a bereavement payout of £2,000 from the DSS as my husband did not reach pensionable age.

The only asset, therefore is the house, which although we paid £70,000 for it 4 years ago, I would estimate is now worth £180,000, so that would mean that my husband’s share is worth £90,000, which would easily pay off the debts.

As you can imagine, I am absolutely devastated about this, and could not bear to have to put the house up for sale as well as everything else I am struggling to cope with.

Does anyone on this site have a more realistic alternative?
Or a definite answer as to whether the credit card companies would pursue this?
Also, would it be considered that there are extenuating circumstances, because of the brain tumour?
My husband always paid the minimum payment, so was not seen as a bad credit risk, but is there any way that I could argue irresponsible lending?

Petal_3

Hi there

I've just put a post on the Cutting Tax thread as I know there are some clued up people on there with regard to Wills & Finance - hopefully someone will be along shortly to advise.

I just wanted to say that I'm sorry for your loss and hope that everything works out.

(((hugs))) x

MrsMW

Hi Annie, I don't really have any advise, there are better people than me to do that and I'm sure someone will be along soon. I wanted to say how sorry I am to hear your situation, it's bad enough losing your husband with out all these extra problems. I understand what you say about the brain tumours, my late husband suffered the same and was totally unlike his normal salf, in fact the last words he spoke to me were really nasty and very upsetting at the time but I know he didn't mean it.
I'm sure you will get good advice at the CAB and I'm glad your daughter is helping you.
Sending love and hugs and PM me if you want to talk.

paul10mm

Hi
im sorry to hear of your loss
Your husbands debts were they only in his name? if they are credit card and unsecured loans
you do not have to pay any of them a lot of companys well suggest you have to its simply not true They only need to see his death certificate Do not pay anyone anything untill you have had your meeting
They were his debts not yours
I wish you well

Tootsie_Roll

Really very sorry to hear your news. My Father died last year after 45 years of marriage and my Mum was completely devastated, I can certainly understand your loss.

As has previously been noted you need to get expert advice as the whole probate/estate thing is a difficult maze to navigate, particularly under the circumstances - at least you have the support of your Daughter.

Any debts that are joint will fall for you to resolve - possibly only the overdraft on your bank account. Any other debt just belonging to your Husband will need to be paid from his estate which does unfortunately look like meaning his share of the equity. I am a bit vague on this and cannot remember if the type of tenancy you have makes any difference i.e 'tennacy in common' etc etc. This could make a difference as it is possible his share of the house will transfer to you automatically and not form part of his estate - this is why you need expert advice.

So a bit of a non answer really - I will try to find something more definative for you.

Kind regards

desperate_annie

Thank you all so much for your messages of support. Even if I don't find any answers here, just knowing that I and my daughter are not going through this on our own is a huge help. And, yes, you're all right about how lucky I am to have here helping me, and I really am so grateful for that, although realise that it is also a huge strain for her too.
And thank you Petal for putting a post on the other thread.

To answer a couple of queries, yes, the credit cards were all in my husband's name only - I did not know anything about them. The only debt in joint name was the overdraft on our bank account.
Unfortunately, re the house, we actually had a legal agreement where we owned 50% of the house each, which we were advised would mean that if one of us went into nursing care, then only 50% of the house could be used to pay for that. This does mean that 50% of the value of the house forms part of my husband's estate and therefore I suppose could technically be taken to pay off the debts.
Advice on how best to deal with/negotiate with the credit card companies would be gratefully received.
Best wishes to you all

magicmaria

I am so sorry for your loss, my husband died 2 years ago aged 44 and left a lot of debt credit cards, bank loans and a car loan as they were all in his name you are not liable for any of them. Were you joint names on the mortgage?? I immediately sent a copy of the death certificate to the mortgage company and the mortgage was put straight away in my own name. Send a copy of the death certificate to all his creditors asking them to cancel out the debt. I didn't even use a solictor I just did it all myself.

Bossyboots

I am really sorry for your loss and for the situation you are now in. I read the thread at work so could not help out any earlier.

Anyway, I have spoken to a probate manager about this today and having re-read the thread with the benefit of his input, then it certainly does look as though the creditors will be able to claim their money from his share of the house as this would be quantified as his estate. He said he thought the cards with the lower amounts might be written off but not the large amounts.

However, he also said that at the present time there is no-one for the creditors to take action against (you can't sue someone who has died). It will only be when someone obtains probate that the creditors can then sue the estate as they can name the executor. If no-one obtains probate then there is no-one to sue and consequently in reality little they can do. They could attempt to obtain probate themselves at some stage in the future but would then be in the position of having to sue themselves so are unlikely to go down that route.

This is a matter on which he suggested you seek qualified legal advice from someone specialising in PROBATE, who can look at the paperwork and guide you from there. This is not a matter for a debt advisor from the CAB (you are unlikely to get the in depth advice you need at the CAB and there are wider issues here than just the debts). Once you have the advice on the positi

You are not personally liable for any of the debts only in his name and you may be able to protect your home at least in your lifetime, but you need specialised advice to achieve this.

You may be getting conflicting advice about the house because most people would assume that it passes directly to you under survivorship. Unfortunately, because of the agreement you have, that is not the case. Your two halves of the property appear to be separate and therefore technically the debts are realisable on your husband's half of the property. Even if it passed under survivorship, it wouldn't pass free of emcumbrances anyway.

Bossyboots

magicmaria wrote:

I am so sorry for your loss, my husband died 2 years ago aged 44 and left a lot of debt credit cards, bank loans and a car loan as they were all in his name you are not liable for any of them. Were you joint names on the mortgage?? I immediately sent a copy of the death certificate to the mortgage company and the mortgage was put straight away in my own name. Send a copy of the death certificate to all his creditors asking them to cancel out the debt. I didn't even use a solictor I just did it all myself.

How did you get around the issue of your husband owning a share in the property?

For most companies small(ish) debts aren't worth pursuing because of the bad PR involved in trying to obtain money from an estate in these circumstances.

Dora_the_Explorer_5

Anyway, I have spoken to a probate manager about this today and having re-read the thread with the benefit of his input, then it certainly does look as though the creditors will be able to claim their money from his share of the house as this would be quantified as his estate.

Hello Annie, I'm so sorry you find yourself in this position at such a difficult time for you. I'm in a similar position to you, as my mum died 10 days ago, and as Bossyboots has written, all her creditors have to be paid from her estate and I would second the advice to consult a solicitor not the CAB. I hope this helps, will be thinking of you.

lottie26_2

i'm so sorry for your loss, it must be very difficult to get your head around all this but you have the support of your daughter you will get through this.
For all the debts that are in your husbands name i'm sure they can't persure it the only one would be the overdraft because it's in joint names.
I hope you get everything answered for you at CAB. xxxx