Some of you are vultures

carolt

tartanterra wrote: »

It shouldn't escape everyones notice here that whilst there are many winners in a falling housing market, there are also many losers.
Whilst a correction in house prices was long overdue, and should help some people onto the market, many others are going to lose out.
I was lucky to buy my house years ago and have paid my mortgage off, so frankly, it's now irrelavent to me what my house is worth. However, what about the FTB's who have stretched themselves to the limit and now find themselves in huge negative equity? If they have to move area and sell up, then they could be saddled with debt for years. It really isn't something to gloat about, especially, as I would like to think, that the MSE forums are a mutually supportive network.
I was in my local last night and so many of the old faces are missing, simply because they worked in the building trade and are now unable to find work. Many of them were struggling to pay mortgages and raise kids before the downturn.
Watching others suffer and struggle is not pleasant, especially at this time of year. Let's hope for everyones sake, we can reach some level of stability soon.

Agreed - from my point of view, once prices have fallen at least 50%. That way, I and other FTB's will be able to buy without potentially bankrupting our families too.

Of course, what your posts highlights is just why this thread has gone on so long, and why this Board is one of the most heated on MSE.

Because in the usual MSE ethos of 'Us' winning out against 'Them', 'Them' is some faceless corporation, assumed to be loaded and ripping us off. Here the 'Them' is just other buyers and sellers, with families like ourselves (well, in the main, excluding new-builds bought off developers etc).

And the sums of money involved are huge.

So not surprisingly, tempers get very frayed on both sides.

This thread is a salutary reminder that there are victims on both sides of the divide. Without a communist-type set-up, where property is just allocated according to need, this will always be the case.

Good will to all! Seasonal greetings!

sarkin

tesuhoha wrote: »

I think you've twisted my words here. He was not making money on the back of the housing boom, he was doing his job, he didn't earn mega bucks, certainly not the £70k+ that some have mentioned, and he worked very hard for his money without any holiday pay, sick pay, or pension. The people I'm talking about that made money on the back of the housing boom are the property investors who bought and sold houses for profit, making hundreds of thousands of pounds.

I suppose there must have been tradespeople quoting silly prices but my OH wasn't one of them because TBH he doesn't like private work in people's houses, he prefers to work mainly on empty new builds because he can just get on with the work without any complications. I'm not talking about money here.

Let me ask you this, if he earned so much money at plumbing what are we doing in a grotty three bedroomed house that we can't afford to do up with a ten year old car sitting outside with 90,000 on the clock (so that I can get to work) and an eight year old van with 120,000 on the clock, with barely the money for the mortgage in the bank and no money for the van insurance, no holiday whatsoever for the last 6 years, no going out, no new clothes for the same amount of time, a £1,000 tax bill in the drawer that I am saving up to pay, no Christmas presents for anyone, no food in the cupboards, the heating turned off, the clothes drying on the cold radiators because I can't afford to buy a tumble dryer, the washing machine on the blink and the grass outside uncut because I haven't got a lawnmower and my husband talking about having to work till he's 70 because he doesn't have a pension?

Maybe if you spent less time posting and more time working, you would have more money or do you not work?

caveman38

tesuhoha wrote: »

I think you've twisted my words here. He was not making money on the back of the housing boom, he was doing his job, he didn't earn mega bucks, certainly not the £70k+ that some have mentioned, and he worked very hard for his money without any holiday pay, sick pay, or pension. The people I'm talking about that made money on the back of the housing boom are the property investors who bought and sold houses for profit, making hundreds of thousands of pounds.

I suppose there must have been tradespeople quoting silly prices but my OH wasn't one of them because TBH he doesn't like private work in people's houses, he prefers to work mainly on empty new builds because he can just get on with the work without any complications. I'm not talking about money here.

Let me ask you this, if he earned so much money at plumbing what are we doing in a grotty three bedroomed house that we can't afford to do up with a ten year old car sitting outside with 90,000 on the clock (so that I can get to work) and an eight year old van with 120,000 on the clock, with barely the money for the mortgage in the bank and no money for the van insurance, no holiday whatsoever for the last 6 years, no going out, no new clothes for the same amount of time, a £1,000 tax bill in the drawer that I am saving up to pay, no Christmas presents for anyone, no food in the cupboards, the heating turned off, the clothes drying on the cold radiators because I can't afford to buy a tumble dryer, the washing machine on the blink and the grass outside uncut because I haven't got a lawnmower and my husband talking about having to work till he's 70 because he doesn't have a pension?

With the risk of being shouted down, I shall ask.
If during the boom years in the building trade (pre 2007) your husband worked continually and earned say £35-40K. You if I remember from earlier posts work in a school (am I correct)
What the b****y hell did you spend that money on. You say your home is a tip, your van and cars are old bangers and you don't go on holidays. Plus you don't put aside money for his tax either.
Again I stress I am not being rude I am just confused as I'm sure others are..

LilacPixie

Milky_Mocha wrote: »

LilacPixie wrote: »

IMO if losing one salary in a two salary household means financial trouble then you are overstretched.

quote]

Its your opinion but I disagree. You're implying that wherever we have two salaries in a household, the second salary is not required - merely for fun or merely for savings or what?

If a household cannot meet it's essential monthly outgoings (without luxuries) without needing both salaries then yes they are over streched. Losing one salary would mean that the family in question couldn't meet their commitments. Surely you cannot disagree??

To be honest my opinion is probably clouded by the fact debt of all types, including mortgage, makes me uncomfortable.

gjchester

We are trying to move. We looked at a few repossessions, and the only reason we didn't put an offer on one was because we were too slow and it was about to complete but the bank were insisting it was still marketed until exchange of contracts. This is what we were told by the estate agents.

The house was repossessed back in May (so this is before the most recent credit crunch really hit the news), we'll never know why so there's no point discussing if a family were thrown out or the circumstances behind why it happened. At that point the foreclosing bank put it on the market for 6 months, after that it goes to auction regardless.

The house in question was up for £240K, it had no interest for 5 months, no doubt because it was rather overpriced for the area. The estate agent had repeatedly asked (remember they would get no commission if it went to auction) for it to be reduced to a realistic value and the bank kept saying no. At month 5 the bank reduced it to £183K, and within a week an offer was accepted for £165K at which it later sold at.

Who's in the wrong here? The buyer who got this house at a price that is reasonable for the area, or the bank who wanted most profit out of it?

We don't know the circumstances of people who had the house repossessed, it may have been a family or it could be a buy to let that went wrong, but if the bank has been realistic and taken advice about lowering the price earlier they may have achieved a better price for the property than they did. The bank won't care too much, they can try and chase whoever the house was repossessed from for the difference, but they should have had an obligation to sell that house at the best price in the current market, not stubbornly stick at an unrealistic price as the market was falling.

If your looking for vultures look at the banks, they are the ones who are trying to hold repossessed house prices high, and then having to sell cheaply at the last moment to cut their losses. Whoever had this house will have taken a loss that's not in question, what is though is should they have taken such a large loss purely because of the banks wish to squeeze every penny from the sale. If the bank had put the house on the market for £210K, which was about right when they put it on it may or may not have sold, but at least it was about the right price and stood a chance. £240K was so OTT it was not going to sell. Yes the bank may have made a loss at that price point but they will still hang and difference between the achieved price and the outstanding mortgage debt on the neck of the person who was repossessed. All the bank has managed to do was to add more debt to someone who was already struggling.

Lotus-eater

Is it my monitor, or is that font hard to read?

DirectDebacle

Lotus-eater wrote: »

Is it my monitor, or is that font hard to read?

Its your montitor:D

DirectDebacle

gjchester wrote: »

If your looking for vultures look at the banks.....

More like spiders. They trap you in a web of debt, watch you struggle to get out of it then move in for the kill.

Davesnave

Lotus-eater wrote: »

Is it my monitor, or is that font hard to read?

Definitely the monitor. Go out and buy a new one. You know it makes sense. Gordon will be proud of you.:rotfl:

tradetime

Lotus-eater wrote: »

Is it my monitor, or is that font hard to read?

Does this help?