urgent help needed with bailiff please.

Mander

I think it's part of their training to be as rude and intimidating as possible. They are trying to manipulate you into paying. Just keep the windows shut and the door locked!

RobertoMoir

jo1980 wrote: »

thanks for all the advice, i'm going to ring the council and see if they will let me pay it through them.

i forgot to mention the bailiff was very aggresive on the phone, spoke to me like a naughty schoolboy, accused me of avoiding the debt for 3 years, when i tried to explain he would just talk over me, when i said he wouldn't be getting into my house he said i would be looking at 2 weeks in jail and then have to pay it when i get out.
and the final insult was to hang up on me.

All the crap about putting you in prison is nonsense designed to intimidate you. The bailiff doesn't make those kinds of decisions, they simply enforce the warrant that is in front of them. (An arrest warrant may eventually be issued when all other avenues are exhausted, mind you, but that's a totally separate process and the bailiff is not involved except for the part where they enforce the arrest warrant once it's put in front of them).

Which brings me to another point. I don't condone their rudeness, but why you have the warrant issued against you is not the bailiff's problem. They just enforce the warrants that are passed to them, and while they have to stay within the guidelines of the council that issued the warrant, it really is up to them how they operate within those guidelines. I'm not saying that to be rude, just to explain the system to you.

You don't mention receiving any overdue notices or a summons for the court order which must exist before bailiffs can be instructed. This may be an avenue for getting the council to take the debt back from the bailiffs.

jo1980 wrote: »

thats why i'm worried if the council don't agree i'm going to have to deal with this moron, and there is just no reasoning with him.

I'm going to repost some general advice I've posted on what bailiffs can and can not do.

You shouldn't allow them into your home, but if they have a warrant that allows them to do so, it's up to them to attempt to gain entry peacefully, not for you to tell them whether or not you allow them to! I'm a former bailiff and we never used to take much notice of what people told us they were going to "allow" us to do, we simply concentrated on what we were legally entitled to do.

Ok. For this kind of debt, unless the bailiff has been into your house already and has levied distress on goods in the house and got you to sign a document called a 'walking possession' then they cannot force their way into your house.

They only have the right to gain 'peaceable entry' (presuming my assumptions are correct about them not being in before).

• Peaceable entry doesn't include kicking your door down or getting a locksmith to drill your locks. This is something they can't do.
• Peaceable entry does include tricking someone into letting them in "Oh really? You say you've spoke to the council, can I come in to use your phone to double-check what they said?"
• Peaceable entry does include climbing in through an open window or going round the back to try your back door in case you forgot to lock it.

Speak to the council and find out for yourself if they won't accept an arrangement from you. Some will and some won't in my experience. If they do, great; if they don't, then it isn't like you've lost anything or incurred more costs just for asking.

Be very careful about letting the bailiff into your house to levy distress. Once they're in, they have the right to remove goods there and then. Not saying they will, in fact they probably won't because they'd rather have the money, but you do need to understand the stakes that you're playing with at this point.

RobertoMoir

mommyme wrote: »

go on the debt free wannabe board but i can assure you the only way they can get in your house is if you let them. Legally - they HAVE to go to court to get a court order to enter your house and they wouldnt have done that if this is the first visit.

Mommyme, the advice you give below is very good indeed (though you seem to be confusing bailiffs with debt collectors in some parts?), but what you say above is incorrect. If a bailiff has been issued with a warrant of execution for this debt (and they wouldn't be dealing with it at all if they hadn't) then that is all they need in order to gain peaceable entry to a house and start seizing goods.

They absolutely do not need to return to the courts to get any further paperwork in order to do that.

When I've worked as a bailiff, I've gained entry to a house and removed goods on the very first visit because I felt that the debtor was totally un co-operative (e.g. won't pay rather than can't pay) and I had no other way to proceed with clearing the debt. That was my decision as the bailiff on the spot. I didn't need any further permission or paperwork from the council or the court to enforce the debt that way on the first visit.

And for this type of procedure against this type of debt, they are in no way entitled to force entry, again regardless of paperwork they have now.

mommyme wrote: »

Ive had loads of dealings with baliffs - my OH has over £30k in debt and they were threatening same thing and do you know - theyve never been in my house. Dont deal with them over the phone - they use scqare tactics - only deal with them in writing and ask them for proff they own the debt - alot of debt companies dont have the correct paperwork so they aren't actually able to persue the debt but they try it on and hope the scare tactics will bully you into paying before you realise this.

DO NOT LET THEM IN YOUR HOUSE TO WRITE DOWN THINGS YOU OWN - if you do they can come and take these. If you own a car - move it down the street but whatever you do - dont let them in.

make sure you pm herbie though, shes brill at getting them off your back and dealing with you legit.

Take care xx

jo1980_2

Hi there. Thanks for your help. The only paperwork I have recieved it from Equita two letters saying I owe the the money, I called them and was speaking to an adviser. The council tax period they are talking about is when I was recieving council tax benefit (all of it was paid) The adviser gave me afew days to write to council and request in writting the figures they were talking about and for me to produce evidence of my benefits at that time, this is a long process! And still nothing from council. Next letter is a REMOVAL ORDER saying they have no option but to instruct bailffs to remove our possessions from our home. It also says as its christmas if we make an immediate payment of 50% they will allow me untill the end of Jan 09 to pay the rest. I called equita only to be given a mobile number as its outof there hands, Bailiff would not accept £100 installments. And hung up on me.

RobertoMoir

OK. I'd phone the council and use the tactics suggested by Airwolf1. I'd also see if you can get help from Herbie via the http://www.bailiffadviceonline.co.uk/ website, if not in here. It sounds a little suspect to me as to whether or not they've correctly followed process to get a warrant for this debt.

Mimi_Arc_en_ciel

RobertoMoir wrote: »

Mommyme, the advice you give below is very good indeed (though you seem to be confusing bailiffs with debt collectors in some parts?), but what you say above is incorrect. If a bailiff has been issued with a warrant of execution for this debt (and they wouldn't be dealing with it at all if they hadn't) then that is all they need in order to gain peaceable entry to a house and start seizing goods.

They absolutely do not need to return to the courts to get any further paperwork in order to do that.

When I've worked as a bailiff, I've gained entry to a house and removed goods on the very first visit because I felt that the debtor was totally un co-operative (e.g. won't pay rather than can't pay) and I had no other way to proceed with clearing the debt. That was my decision as the bailiff on the spot. I didn't need any further permission or paperwork from the council or the court to enforce the debt that way on the first visit.

And for this type of procedure against this type of debt, they are in no way entitled to force entry, again regardless of paperwork they have now.

thats what i was told when i first came to this board? never had baliffs remove goods from my house - only baliff who has ever gotten in was when OH first got in trouble and i stupidly let them in and he never removed anything from the house just did a walking posession.

needaspirin

Bailiff fees:

In English council tax arrears cases, for each liability order where no levy is made, £24.50 for the first or only visit, and £18.00 for a second visit, can be charged. No charge can be made for subsequent visits. If the bailiffs visit only once, but in respect of two separate liability orders, they may make two sets of charges.

(Therefore in your case total visiting fee is £42.50)


If you let the bailiff in:
The fee that can be charged for levying distress where the sum due is less than £100 is £24.50.

Where the sum due is more than £100, the following fees are payable:-
For the first £100 - 24.5% (£24.50)
For the next £400 - 4%
For the next £1,500 - 2.5%
For the next £8,000 - 1%
For any additional sum - 0.25%

(Therefore for £545 the fee is £41.63)

Vehicle attendance fees are only to be charged after a levy has been made. They may only be charged once. Bailiff can charge a reasonable amount.


The Council is unlikely to take back the debt from the bailiff unless you are a vulnerable person or can prove severe hardship. Obviously you are challenging the debt, but it has already been to court unbeknown to you and judgement has been entered by default. The Council should put the bailiff on hold while your challenge is examined.

CAB advice is not to allow the bailiff entry. Even where a warrant has been issued very few Councils will allow bailiffs to force entry. Although there are a lot of people capable of dealing with bailiffs themselves, particularly among MSE members, I would advise you to get down to your CAB first thing Monday morning. Equita has some very charming bailiffs and it looks like you have got one of them. CAB will know of him and may be keeping a file with the intention of making a complaint.

RobertoMoir

mommyme wrote: »

thats what i was told when i first came to this board?

Then you were either wrongly advised or there was something particular to your case that doesn't apply here / in general.

mezelks

Forgot to mention in my last post...
It's Equita that have been giving me the bullyboy tactics too.
Stick with being firm, and definitley take others advice of going to council. Go in person if you have someone at home to keep an eye on the place

pinkshoes

Do you not have the paperwork from the council stating that you were in receipt of council tax relief?

Any update?