The Myth of record debt!

WTF?_2

StevieJ wrote: »

No I would advise them to wait until April, but definately well before the concession on stamp duty finishes as we should see demand jump at that time. BTW I noticed that house sales have increased for the second month running, I can't find your link on the board to the article.


(By the way, still waiting for the quote in the other thread where you accused me of "changing my mind again"

As you know I can't find the link, it was litle like finding a needle in a haystack with the needle removed. Ironically everyone knows what you said as it was well highlighted at the time.

First - I don't remove posts. If they are changed or I take something down due to double post or whatever I make a note. I haven't ever completely removed a post like Chucky and Dithering Dad do as a matter of course. I stand by what I say instead of being ashamed of what it tells the world about me.

Second, if 'everyone knows' then it won't be hard to find something to back up what you say, will it? Even if I should have deleted the post as you accuse me of, there will have been some quotes of what I said in someone elses post or a response to it.


I suggest if you are serious about engaging in debate with me, you take a look at the nature of your own posts which seem to be based upon your misguided notion of what you think I would have said rather than what I actually have said.

Frankly, your posts seem to be consisting more and more of pure antagonism rather than any serious attempt to have a discussion.

PS: I see you are calling the end of the bear market in April. We shall have to revisit this one then.

Dithering_Dad

!!!!!!? wrote: »

First - I don't remove posts. If they are changed or I take something down due to double post or whatever I make a note. I haven't evercompletely removed a post like Chucky and Dithering Dad do as a matter of course. I stand by what I say instead of being ashamed of what it tells the world about me.

lol, this gives such an insight into !!!!!!'s sad life! He 'notes down' his changes! I can just see him now with his pencil and little ringbound notebook, jotting down the date and time and details of his original post and the date, time and modification details of any changes he makes to his post.

He stands by what he says and isn't ashamed of what it 'tells the world'. Again, this displays the ego of the man - he ACTUALLY believes the 'world' is reading his sad little posts!!! :rotfl: And how one can anyone be 'ashamed' about what they post anonymously on an anonymous internet forum is beyond me. Perhaps !!!!!! feels that one day the researchers at the National Archives will track him down after reading one of his amazing posts? The messiah of economics!

Funny how !!!!!! keeps muttering on about how others delete their posts, yet his seem to be disappearing all the time!

I've said it before and I'll say it again... !!!!!! is the King of Hypocrites!

chucky

Dithering_Dad wrote: »

lol, this gives such an insight into !!!!!!'s sad life! He 'notes down' his changes! I can just see him now with his pencil and little ringbound notebook, jotting down the date and time and details of his original post and the date, time and modification details of any changes he makes to his post.

He stands by what he says and isn't ashamed of what it 'tells the world'. Again, this displays the ego of the man - he ACTUALLY believes the 'world' is reading his sad little posts!!! :rotfl: And how one can anyone be 'ashamed' about what they post anonymously on an anonymous internet forum is beyond me. Perhaps !!!!!! feels that one day the researchers at the National Archives will track him down after reading one of his amazing posts? The messiah of economics!

Funny how !!!!!! keeps muttering on about how others delete their posts, yet his seem to be disappearing all the time!

I've said it before and I'll say it again... !!!!!! is the King of Hypocrites!

the image of !!!!!! with his ringbound notebook and pencil trawling through he pages looking for the record of a particular post is making me laugh!! :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

tomstickland

So, what are you adding to this debate?

dopester

!!!!!!? wrote: »

Mortgage free is the place to be - owning your own place outright puts you at least a little bit out of the rat race. Nothing worse than feeling you are on a treadmill to keep your mortgage payments up and being at the mercy of the markets and interest rate policy etc.

Exactly. That is another reason I question your logic for wanting to leverage your position, and put your main home at risk, with BTL when perhaps, perhaps we reach the bottom of the market, which I don't see bouncing back at all.

Have you not learned from the mistakes of others? A few voids... your own income position changes, some legal action against a landlord for liability on something like a window frame accident (which I've read about).. or any number of stress related issues with a BTL, and your own home is at risk. You really want that - it isn't for me.

Not least the consequences of previous credit-crunches have held down property and land values for decades, and the banks need to recapitalise over many years, and won't be foolish to fuel a property bubble, and jobs and general wages will remain depressed for a very long time - unless we have some technological breakthroughs.

dopester

!!!!!!? wrote: »

Still, two things to bear in mind

(1) Losing your job is largely outside your control. No point worrying about it.

(2) Most people keep their jobs even in a recession.

This for me will be a deflationary depression... and only if a breaking point is reached, will you have the inflation you want to wipe out the financial economy.

Unemployment looks set to be worse, due to company profits being worse, and become, even without wage increases... just static real wage rates are beginning to rise next due to the deflationary pressures. Wage cuts ahead.

WTF?_2

dopester wrote: »

Exactly. That is another reason I question your logic for wanting to leverage your position, and put your main home at risk, with BTL when perhaps, perhaps we reach the bottom of the market, which I don't see bouncing back at all.

Have you not learned from the mistakes of others? A few voids... your own income position changes, some legal action against a landlord for liability on something like a window frame accident (which I've read about).. or any number of stress related issues with a BTL, and your own home is at risk. You really want that - it isn't for me.

Not least the consequences of previous credit-crunches have held down property and land values for decades, and the banks need to recapitalise over many years, and won't be foolish to fuel a property bubble, and jobs and general wages will remain depressed for a very long time - unless we have some technological breakthroughs.

I'd wait until I'd been in my home for at leat a year before even thinking about BTL, should give time for the market to settle.

Plus given that I'd own my primary home outright I'd be leveraged at 2:1 at most over the whole deal, probably less as a BTL would be something like a cheap flat or modest house. Not exactly high leverage stakes.

BTL and buying a house are not always a bad idea - it just so happens that those two things have been about the worst thing you could have done with your money over the last couple of years.

And I'd stress, it's an idea not a firm plan and based on circumstance. If we actually do get lasting deflation (I don't believe that we will), it's total no-no. But at the end of the day in an inflationary environment it seems to me that banks are not the place to trust to deliver a decent return on your money.

It's not easy to make a decent return on BTL either of course, even at lower prices. My LL is making only a very modest return on the house I live in and he bought it at the end of the 90s. However, over the next couple of decades it should deliver a decent income stream especially when the mortgage is paid so I can see where he's coming from.

Gorgeous_George

I'm not in debt.

I'm asset rich.

I've got stuff!

(Loads of stuff in my garage for starters).



GG

dopester

!!!!!!? wrote: »

It's not easy to make a decent return on BTL either of course, even at lower prices. My LL is making only a very modest return on the house I live in and he bought it at the end of the 90s. However, over the next couple of decades it should deliver a decent income stream especially when the mortgage is paid so I can see where he's coming from.

Well if you are going to do it, I hope you choose a property which allows you options.

I know a guy in the last crash, who rented out all the rooms in his house as places to live/sleep-over cheaply, and even had people sleeping in the loft sometimes (with steep ladder access).

I hope you factor in how skint many people will be, and even those who aren't fully skint, looking for bargains as they need to make their money go further. Nor under-estimate that it is possible we'll see big cutbacks in benefit payments for things like housing benefit.

StevieJ

dopester wrote: »

Exactly. That is another reason I question your logic for wanting to leverage your position, and put your main home at risk, with BTL when perhaps, perhaps we reach the bottom of the market, which I don't see bouncing back at all.

Have you not learned from the mistakes of others? A few voids... your own income position changes, some legal action against a landlord for liability on something like a window frame accident (which I've read about).. or any number of stress related issues with a BTL, and your own home is at risk. You really want that - it isn't for me.

Not least the consequences of previous credit-crunches have held down property and land values for decades, and the banks need to recapitalise over many years, and won't be foolish to fuel a property bubble, and jobs and general wages will remain depressed for a very long time - unless we have some technological breakthroughs.

I recommend this for post of the year, Dopster taking !!!!!! to task for wanting to be a BTLer.


Have you not learned from the mistakes of others? :rotfl: