NI Presbyterian mutual society, Short of funds for withdrawal?

john2009

Hi folks,

Since my first post I have been looking at the company investigator angle and one can be appointed in NI by DETI. This can be done even though PMS is in administration. It is worth looking at a bit more closely.

freddiemae

crazymess wrote: »

Can we then go for a Class Action? Or can we not do this while PMS is in administration?

As far as I knew there was no class action system in UK but this link may prove interesting to you
http://www.out-law.com/page-9625
European Commission consults on class action lawsuits

OUT-LAW News, 27/11/2008

Consumers across the European Union could be given new powers to join forces to sue a business under plans announced by the European Commission today. Class action lawsuits could be publicly funded under the proposals.

The Commission's Green Paper on Consumer Collective Redress proposes new ways of dealing with situations where large numbers of consumers have been harmed by a single trader's practice which is in breach of consumer law.

Consumer Commissioner Meglena Kuneva said that many such cases currently fall through a hole in the justice system.

“Consumers who are victims of illegal activities, such as overcharging, misleading advertising or outright scams, have a right to compensation," she said. "Currently, particularly where there are small scattered claims, this right is often theoretical because of the obstacles to exercising it in practice."

Hope this might help you

crazymess

Maybe Mills Selig in Arthur Street, Belfast might be able to shed some light!!!!!!

Anyone dealt with them before???????

expat68

D.A. wrote: »

It would have been, yes.

A report is here:

http://www.presbyterianireland.org/news/news2009/news0653.html

quote]

Is it just me or does it seem like the PCI really haven't achieved or indeed done a great deal since the more than 3 months when they became aware of the PMS issue.I must say I personally am very disappointed at the PCI response and am getting a little tired of having scripture quoted at me instead of some positive actions beyond hanging on the coat tails of others (petition, NI assembly etc)

red_bertie

Forgive me for being crude, but it's soooooooooo much easier to sit with your 'thumb up your b*m', quote scripture and hope it will all die down or HMG [or anyone other than your church]will sort it, rather than acknowledge [even] part ownership/responsibility of the problem. I think this is PCI policy.

fivealive_2

expat68 wrote: »

http://www.presbyterianireland.org/news/news2009/news0653.html

An excerpt from the above:

"In general the advice was to say little until the Administrator was able to make a full and accurate assessment of the Society. The Committee also considered a possible letter from the Moderator to follow up that of the Clerk. A small group was appointed to advise the Moderator on this letter, which was sent to all Ministers on 21 November, 2008. A copy is appended."

Can anyone get their hands on a copy of this letter? My interpretation of the above excerpt is that the Ministers were told by the hierarchy "whatever you say, say nothing"? :silenced:
What do the rest of you think?

crazymess

fivealive wrote: »

An excerpt from the above:

"In general the advice was to say little until the Administrator was able to make a full and accurate assessment of the Society. The Committee also considered a possible letter from the Moderator to follow up that of the Clerk. A small group was appointed to advise the Moderator on this letter, which was sent to all Ministers on 21 November, 2008. A copy is appended."

Can anyone get their hands on a copy of this letter? My interpretation of the above excerpt is that the Ministers were told by the hierarchy "whatever you say, say nothing"? :silenced:
What do the rest of you think?

I have been constantly asking our Minister about reference any communication from PCI - I have also asked Elders. I have been told nothing about any communications from them.

I also asked about the Hardship Fund - again no feedback. IS THERE OR IS THERE NOT A HARDSHIP FUND PCI???????? Answer the questions for once please.

Remember this is extremely difficult - Ministers and their Congregations who have money involved in this really can't go and give off to their BOSSES - As a saver with the PMS its hard also to give off to our Ministers as what can they do?

Thats why I think its time - when we hear back from Administrator next week - to deal with this ourselves - legally - and then perhaps PCI will listen to us.

crazymess

From the Mail on Sunday today!!!!!!!!

PRESBYTERIAN SAVERS HEAD FOR WIND-UP

The Administrator of stricken PMS will write to its 10000 savers tomorrow detailing the results of a ballot on the organisation's future. Members are expected to have called for an orderly wind-up.

A run on the Belfast-based society pushed it into insolvency and it closed its doors in November. Is assets are thought to fall £120 million short of the £300 million it owes savers.

Administrator Arthur Boyd hopes that gradual disposals - rather than a fire sale - will reduce depositors' ultimate losses. The assets are primarily mortgage books and commercial properties in Scotland and the North, none of which will shift easily in the present market, says Boyd.

It is hoped that savers, who are mainly elderly, risk-adverse and not well off, may eventually receive 60p in the pound. In the meantime, they hope to be given small, regular distributions.

PMS was founded in 1982 to encourage churchgoers to save and was endorsed by the Presbyterian Church. It was structured as an 'industrial and provident society' so is not regulated by the FSA. Deposits are unprotected.

Savers and MPs have appealed to the Government and even written to Gordon Brown, himself a Presbyterian, asked for the authorities to intervene.

................................

fivealive_2

crazymess wrote: »

I also asked about the Hardship Fund - again no feedback. IS THERE OR IS THERE NOT A HARDSHIP FUND PCI???????? Answer the questions for once please.

It really is worth ploughing your way through the report of Friday's meeting on http://www.presbyterianireland.org/news/news2009/news0653.html

The answer it gives to your question about a hardship fund is as follows:

13. The question of Benevolent/Hardship Funds was again considered, in the context of all those Presbyterians who may have pressing needs for whatever reason. Up to the present, the existing funds have proved sufficient for any requests of that nature. The Trustees have agreed that the Scott Benevolent Fund may be used to cover needs not already met by the Indigent Ladies, Old Age or Presbyterian Women's Funds. This Fund's resources may be supplemented, if needed, from the Trustees' Discretionary Fund. It was therefore agreed that no special provision needs to be made at present to meet the acute benevolent needs of members, but this will be kept under review.

Can anyone please tell me what on earth is an "Indigent Lady" as I am mystified?
:think:

crazymess

fivealive

Thank you - but is that specific to PMS savers?

My point is also that the PCI said that FEW had taken up their offer of a Hardship fund - it was not public knowledge and also it was only available if you couldn't afford to buy food or pay for the electric!

Maybe I'm wrong - but I understand they could not help with tax bills etc.


Oh - just looked it up - Indigent Ladies Fund - financial assistance for the over 60's - gosh PCI YOU HAVE THIS ALL TIED UP NICELY!