NI Presbyterian mutual society, Short of funds for withdrawal?

ballyblack

16 October 2009 11:06 HM Treasury (Northern Ireland)

The Presbyterian Mutual Society Working Group met yesterday to review progress on finding a solution to help Presbyterian Mutual Society Members. The Working Group Chair Liam Byrne, Chief Secretary to the Treasury, updated members on progress made by his officials.

He said:

“I sympathise with the considerable difficulties in which many of the PMS members find themselves. We will continue working together on options for a solution”

The First Minister, Peter Robinson, emphasized the need for finding an acceptable resolution as quickly as possible. He stated:

“We are very aware of the anxiety and distress caused to members of the Presbyterian Mutual Society by the prevailing uncertainties around their savings and we are encouraged by the outcome of today’s ministerial Working Group meeting.

We are doing all we can to work towards achieving a quick solution for PMS members and I want to assure members of the Presbyterian Mutual Society that this matter is still very much receiving our close attention.”

Initial negotiations with a number of banks have already begun. The Deputy First Minister, Martin McGuinness, highlighted that it would now be necessary to progress these talks further:

“Officials have opened up discussions with the banks concerning a possible financial solution to address PMS’s current position. We should know the outcome of the discussions shortly. We are also expecting a full paper on the full range of options open to resolve the PMS to be presented to the Ministerial Working Group within the next three weeks. When we receive this we can then decide on the best way forward.”

The Northern Ireland Secretary of State, Shaun Woodward, indicated that he would be following events closely and would continue to work towards finding a solution to the Presbyterian Mutual Society problem:

“There are complex issues yet to be resolved, but we continue to strive to identify ways to help PMS members. That is why the Prime Minister set up this Working Group, and our commitment to those members remains.”

Finding a solution to the Presbyterian Mutual Society situation is not without difficulties. There are, for example, potential obstacles such as EU State Aid rules to consider. The Northern Ireland Finance Minister, Sammy Wilson, expressed his desire to reach a quick solution. He said:

“Presbyterian Mutual Society Members have had to cope for too long with uncertainty. Whilst there are complex issues to resolve, I am convinced that these are not insurmountable and I will continue to press for a quick resolution to this issue”.

Arlene Foster, the Northern Ireland Enterprise Minister, echoed the views of her Executive colleagues.

She said:

"Since I passed the necessary legislation allowing the Society to go into administration to protect members’ funds, I and the Executive have done, and are continuing to do, all that we can to help achieve a positive outcome for those members of the Presbyterian Mutual Society who are facing serious financial difficulties.

“Progress continues to be made and the Ministerial Working Group has agreed to meet again in three weeks. Finding a solution is a priority for the Executive and we will leave no stone unturned."

93/09

Notes for Editors

1. The Presbyterian Mutual Society Working Group comprises the Chief Secretary to the Treasury (chair), the Northern Ireland First Minister and deputy First Minister, the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, the Economic Secretary to the Treasury, the Northern Ireland Minister for Finance and Personnel and the Northern Ireland Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Investment.

2. The terms of reference of the Presbyterian Mutual Society Working Group is:
* To investigate the circumstances surrounding the collapse of the PMS.
* To consider the losses incurred by PMS members.
* To consider what, if any, action can be taken to mitigate members’ losses, particularly those hardest hit by the collapse of the PMS.

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goodbyepci

HM Treasury (Northern Ireland)


The Presbyterian Mutual Society Working Group met yesterday to review progress on finding a solution to help Presbyterian Mutual Society Members. The Working Group Chair Liam Byrne, Chief Secretary to the Treasury, updated members on progress made by his officials.

He said:
“I sympathise with the considerable difficulties in which many of the PMS members find themselves. We will continue working together on options for a solution”
The First Minister, Peter Robinson, emphasized the need for finding an acceptable resolution as quickly as possible. He stated:
“We are very aware of the anxiety and distress caused to members of the Presbyterian Mutual Society by the prevailing uncertainties around their savings and we are encouraged by the outcome of today’s ministerial Working Group meeting.
We are doing all we can to work towards achieving a quick solution for PMS members and I want to assure members of the Presbyterian Mutual Society that this matter is still very much receiving our close attention.”
Initial negotiations with a number of banks have already begun. The Deputy First Minister, Martin McGuinness, highlighted that it would now be necessary to progress these talks further:
“Officials have opened up discussions with the banks concerning a possible financial solution to address PMS’s current position. We should know the outcome of the discussions shortly. We are also expecting a full paper on the full range of options open to resolve the PMS to be presented to the Ministerial Working Group within the next three weeks. When we receive this we can then decide on the best way forward.”
The Northern Ireland Secretary of State, Shaun Woodward, indicated that he would be following events closely and would continue to work towards finding a solution to the Presbyterian Mutual Society problem:
“There are complex issues yet to be resolved, but we continue to strive to identify ways to help PMS members. That is why the Prime Minister set up this Working Group, and our commitment to those members remains.”

Finding a solution to the Presbyterian Mutual Society situation is not without difficulties. There are, for example, potential obstacles such as EU State Aid rules to consider. The Northern Ireland Finance Minister, Sammy Wilson, expressed his desire to reach a quick solution. He said:
“Presbyterian Mutual Society Members have had to cope for too long with uncertainty. Whilst there are complex issues to resolve, I am convinced that these are not insurmountable and I will continue to press for a quick resolution to this issue”.
Arlene Foster, the Northern Ireland Enterprise Minister, echoed the views of her Executive colleagues.
She said:

"Since I passed the necessary legislation allowing the Society to go into administration to protect members’ funds, I and the Executive have done, and are continuing to do, all that we can to help achieve a positive outcome for those members of the Presbyterian Mutual Society who are facing serious financial difficulties.
“Progress continues to be made and the Ministerial Working Group has agreed to meet again in three weeks. Finding a solution is a priority for the Executive and we will leave no stone unturned."

Dr._Who_2

Noticed a short article on the front of the News Letter this morning about negotiations with local banks re purchase of PMS: hopefully, this is a sign that progress is being made in bringing forward a "rescue package".
Despite it's problems PMS must, long term, still be attractive to a potential investor - the property portfolio appears to be good, rents are still coming in, hopefully outstanding loans can be reclaimed.
Need to keep on hoping and praying - let's not despair just yet, but if there's no solution soon local Presbyteries will need to become active in calling PMS savers meetings.
You've heard the song "All I want for Christmas is..."
A settlement of PMS and access to frozen funds would be something nice for Christmas - hopefully, someone will want to play "Santa Claus"

ballyblack

link to the News Letter article as stated above

http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/Treasury-in-talks-with-banks.5742374.jp

BETRAYED

My latest news.
Ninety-four year old woman dies on her birthday in nursing home in Ballyclare not knowing what is going to happen to her savings in PMS.

Retired minister's wife in Broughshane needs to go privately for an eye operation to save her eyesight. She is unable to access her savings in PMS.
Sad facts.

HOPE

Betrayed

This is sad indeed and very sad throughout the province and in the Republic. The suffering continues. I know of two deaths of savers during this past few weeks. One in a similiar situation to the lady in the Nursing Home and the other person's funeral money is in the PMS.

HOPE

Jon Groovy

Just wondering have you actually ever brought this to their attention and whether you got any response.


To say that ministers took their money out last Autumn is pure speculation and clearly there is no evidence of that.

Flinflon

I'm sure that some individual ministers must be aware of the hardship in their own flocks without their being an onus on jon-groovy to tell them. But I happen to know a couple of ministers who indicate they can't be bothered with the nuisance of PMS savers' problems. By the way, to be fair: jon_groovy didn't say that ministers took their money out last autumn. He asked if they had admitted as much. Good question, I think. Let's watch this space and see if any of them do so.

no_more_f.w.o

My experience has been 2 Ministers who did not want to discuss it at all and tried to change the subject.
One who was downright hostile, and took the line of "it's your own fault for being materialistic/greedy"
and one who immediately took the Donald Watts line of a separate legal entity -
end of conversation.

As for any offers of help or the so called hardship fund - it wasn't mentioned.

Quite shocking!

HOPE

Flinflon wrote: »

I'm sure that some individual ministers must be aware of the hardship in their own flocks without their being an onus on jon-groovy to tell them. But I happen to know a couple of ministers who indicate they can't be bothered with the nuisance of PMS savers' problems. By the way, to be fair: jon_groovy didn't say that ministers took their money out last autumn. He asked if they had admitted as much. Good question, I think. Let's watch this space and see if any of them do so.

Flinflon - From my reading there was an inference that ministers took money out and had they admitted it and that is my reading of it. Whether they did or not what difference would it have made - none. It was the banks who caused the run by putting PMS savers under pressure to move their money because there was no government guarantee. We are talking millions here by big savers.

I agree there are ministers who are not at all sympathetic but I think these are few and far between.