NI Presbyterian mutual society, Short of funds for withdrawal?

goodbyepci

So we vote YES to everything then?

Only chance that it won't go into liquidation?

goodbyepci

unless you have 2 million in it and losing your 20k shares would be a better outcome that losing 40%

I simply don't understand this, can you explain it please?

Think I'll have to go see a solicitor for advice too.

crazymess

Goodbyepci


As it stands - if it goes into liquidation now - then the CREDITORS ARE PAID FIRST - in other words those with over £20000.

There will be nothing left to pay the other 7000 investors -

Either way ORDERLY WIND DOWN OR LIQUIDATION - it will still be the same.

Mark789

crazymess wrote: »

Eldivo

I don't have scanner - they are my written questions and answers from a verbal conversation with PMS. I can assure you if I was told 85 million was lent to Property Developers in mid-September and only 12 million to Church Congregations I would have gone down to Glengall Street immediately demanding repayment of our investment! I was misled and further asked by PMS "where are you going to the put the money?" - my reply was in National Savings. I was completely put off withdrawing our money and I trusted the information I was given then. I am now suffering because of their not telling me the full story.

It still amazes my how they are still going to work in Glengall Street everyday knowing the pain and suffering they have caused.

I believe your written questions and answers to a verbal conversation would constitute a contemperaneous record and, as such, could be used as evidence. This would be reinforced if you reported to your congregation and the responses were minuted.

goodbyepci

how can we make sure laim clarke knows that 7000 plus members stand to get nothing if the vote goes a certain way ?

Liam Clarke has written articles on the PMS in the Newsletter and the Sunday Times.
Maybe you could try phoning them for his contact details?

D.A.

ballyblack wrote: »

.

He also has very strong family ties to the Presbyterian Church and I have no doubt he is fully aware of the situation

As does William Crawley, having been an ordained minister (not entirely sure if he still is). William would also be well aware of the workings of Church House. Since Liam Clarke and William appear to be the only journalists (apart from David Gordon) with any trace of investigative journalism left in them (since the Tele has apparently given up on journalism) they would be your best allies here.

expat68

quote from Colin Ferguson on Newsletter article mid november (14th November to be exact)- they used the inverted commas not me.

http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/Assets-are-safe-church-fund.4694269.jp?articlepage=1

“There is no notion that these loans will not be repaid, they are all given against security such as property.”

Administrators report page 38 Directors notes on Statement of Affairs as at 17 November - "Given the current economic and financial climate the directors are of the view that the sale of the society's entire loan book would generate less than half of the book value".

The above are printed facts , i make no accusations or judgements. As far as i am aware Mr Ferguson continues to receive his monthly salary from PMS funds.

Perhaps someone from the Newsletter reading this would like to contact Mr Ferguson for comment.

warmhands.coldheart

Under the new proposals for the new Government Bailout

"Under the Bank of England's new role, it will be able to buy up to £50bn of high quality assets directly from companies.
In the past, it has only bought such assets from banks or financial institutions. A new subsidiary company will be set up to buy the assets, but the Bank's executive will decide what sort of assets it will buy and from which companies."

I wander if the PMS's Assets are "High Quality"

goodbyepci

Presbyterian church 'must make up cash shortfall'

By Noel McAdam
Monday, 19 January 2009

The Presbyterian Church has a moral obligation to make up the cash shortfall facing members of the Mutual Society, a senior Ulster Unionist has insisted.
David McNarry, himself a Presbyterian, said the Church should also ensure members do not have to wait a long time to receive their monies.
The Strangford MLA said church members were “thoroughly disgusted” by events which had lead to the society going into administration and were asking ‘how could the Church allow this to happen?’.
And asked how the Church should find the money — which could amount to 25% of the total owed — he said: “I don’t care. When this problem first arose the Church made it clear it was an entirely separate entity, which is totally contrary to what most people thought, they
thought it was part and parcel of the Church. As I understand it, you cannot be in the society unless you are a Presbyterian and Ministers would have recommended you invest in it.
“I am not in the society myself but I know people who are and they felt it was the safest bank because the Church would never have allowed anything happen their money.”
The former UUP chief whip, whose party leader Sir Reg Empey and deputy Assembly leader Danny Kennedy have asked to meet Executive Minis
ter Arlene Foster over the issue, said: “The Church should be picking up the balance. The Church has a moral obligation to ensure people are not out of pocket. It is not clear exactly what the shortfall between what people are owed and the monies left is but it looks like it could be in the region of 25%..”
A Church spokesman said: “As has been widely reported, a small group called together by the Moderator, Dr Donald Patton, is exploring various possibilities to consider what can be done. Existing benevolent funds both at congregational and central level are making small grants available at the discretion of local ministers in situations of extreme hardship.
“In seeing what more can be done, the group has become increasingly aware of the complexity of the problem and the obstacles that would take time to overcome. Further development of any possibilities are dependent on an indication of the size of any shortfall.”
From the Belfast Telegraph

warmhands.coldheart

Sorry to sidetrack the issue a bit but if the PCI would get of the moral high ground and accept money from the Lottery, be it Heritage funds or money for clubs etc then maybe congregations wouldn't have had to borrow so much money from the PMS..

Church of Ireland & R.Catholic church seem to have no problem with taking Lottery money... OK it's come from gambling.. but then of course there are NO Presbyterians who do the lottery.. are there... sinners!!.... Take the money where you can.. it's for the greater good.... sorry but just my opinion