Importing a Dog from abroad.

LillyJ

simontheiceman wrote: »

one of their dogs was taken in as a stray to the pound and they could not "afford" the release fee of £38. They declined to take the dog back, leaving it to the mercies of a potential rehome or if that fails then euthanasia. They promptly went out and bought this new pup for £60. Hands up all who think this acceptable?

Oh. My. God.

What hideous people. It really makes me wonder about the emotional health of the people concerned if they can do things like that.

simontheiceman

LillyJ wrote: »

Oh. My. God.

What hideous people. It really makes me wonder about the emotional health of the people concerned if they can do things like that.

It gets worse.

I recently attended an international conference on the link between animal abuse and human violence (cheery eh?) and this scenario is exactly the sort of situation which is an indicator of what is happening to vulnerable humans in the same house (I use this phrase to include children, the elderly and women).

There is, as yet, no formal framework for reporting of these situations but it will happen in due course (It requires the agreement of a large number of agencies to occur).

In the meantime you might like to muse upon the fact that in both the Michael Vick dogfighting case (look it up if you dont know what I am on about) and the Virgina Tech shooting case, both offenders had a history of animal abuse at a much lower level. The FBI have a set of criteria for spotting potential animal/ human abusers and it would scare you to even read them. Needless to say the Americans are streets ahead of us in cross-agency reporting but it doesnt seem to stop them having some of the worst offences committed.

ThePetPsychic

I agree with simon, if a human can 'damage' an animal through their own insecurities, they will often abuse people too, I have experience of many cases of this in my work as a Pet Psychic, the animals often tell me about family members abuse, not only to them, but their humans and other family etc, thankfully some clients admit what is happening and seek help, and escape the violence.
Animals pick up on bad energy's well before us, ALWAYS take notice of your animals judgement. They are normally right.
As for saving the dog abroad, look, if thats what you feel you need to do, I find this sort of thing happens for a reason, it will open up a whole new world to animal welfare, YES I understand there are millions here that need homes, but sometimes, rescuing from abroad happens for a reason. So please do not judge, I am sure this person knows there are dogs here too.
my advice is follow your heart, only you will know what to do.

There are also plenty of people in this country who will foster dogs whilst waiting for new homes, NO DOG needs to be put to sleep these days, unless medical. Also in my experince, I have come across manylovely people who would love to take a dog for life, but do not pass the centers checks, now yes, they put this in place for the dogs welfare, but animals can live with others, they don't always want to escape normal size fences, some are happy with children, and others are happy to live in a flat. (there are lots of people who don't get approved, but would love and exercise the animal better than most) For instance - I live in a bungalow, I am on a main road, I have a normal size fence and gate , I have four wonderful cats and one dog, my life and work is dedicated to full time care of the animals, helping humans connect and animals so they have a better life, BUT.... I would not pass to adopt a dog!!!!!? so you see, sometimes these dogs would have a home if they would just be a little more flexible. I have known many GOOD people to go and buy a puppy because they could not get one from a rescue centre which was their first choice.

foreign_correspondent

simontheiceman wrote: »

It gets worse.

I recently attended an international conference on the link between animal abuse and human violence (cheery eh?) and this scenario is exactly the sort of situation which is an indicator of what is happening to vulnerable humans in the same house (I use this phrase to include children, the elderly and women).

Simon, I agree, this is a field I am very interested in professionally - without wanting to go into too much detail, I work with vulnerable young people and find that very often the problems within a household affect both children and animals - ie. if the adult caregiver lacks the skills, awareness or ability to act responsibly, appropriately and with empathy for its charges.

Sadder still is the fact that often in these situations the children have a very close bond with their pets and so any neglect or abuse of these is really a double whammy, as it often hurts children very deeply. Many children I work with are deeply affected by their families 'getting rid' of the dog - this seems to be equivalent to a bereavement for many kids. Animals are also often targeted in domestic violence cases - it is not unusual to hear of animals being injured or threatened (ie. dangled out of windows etc) to hurt or manipulate another person.

I wish the links were in place for us to deal with these issues together, and for concerns for either animals or childen to trigger examination of the safety of both, as I feel they are so closely interlinked.

I also think adults tend to dismiss the bond children can have with animals, especially in chaotic or unsettled homes, where the dog may be the only source of unconditional love the child has. I would actually like to look at doing some work with vulnerable young people and dogs, as I feel there could be so many benefits, but this would be challenging to develop for many reasons. However, you never know, maybe, at some point in the future...

I also agree with LilyJ that this sort of behaviour suggests some sort of problem with the thought processes/emotional or mental health of the person who acts this way.

ThePetPsychic

FOREIGN,
I am also VERY interested, I have looked at work that they do in America with prisoners and rescue dogs, they have to work together with great success.

Also the best I have seen is a dedicated place where troubled youths are transformed by working with horses, horses (I am a horse owner/carer) have a natural ability to mirror children's personalities, so in order for the children to move on, they need a unique understanding of the challenging aspects of creating harmony with a horse. There have been great success in this area!

homeworkgirl

Also in my experince, I have come across many lovely people who would love to take a dog for life, but do not pass the centers checks, now yes, they put this in place for the dogs welfare, but animals can live with others, they don't always want to escape normal size fences, some are happy with children, and others are happy to live in a flat. (there are lots of people who don't get approved, but would love and exercise the animal better than most) For instance - I live in a bungalow, I am on a main road, I have a normal size fence and gate , I have four wonderful cats and one dog, my life and work is dedicated to full time care of the animals, helping humans connect and animals so they have a better life, BUT.... I would not pass to adopt a dog!!!!!? so you see, sometimes these dogs would have a home if they would just be a little more flexible. I have known many GOOD people to go and buy a puppy because they could not get one from a rescue centre which was their first choice

I totally agree with you here, several months ago when I decided that at last I led a suitable lifestyle to accommodate owning a dog which had always been my dream since a child, I registered with several "Rescues" who were always pleading for adopters to come forward in order to home the hundreds of "unwanted" dogs, yet not one of them offered me a dog. After about 6 wks I happened to spot an ad in my local freeads for a beautiful 6yr old black lab who had to be rehomed for genuine family reasons. We drove the 100 miles to meet him and the rest is history, Harry now has his forever home with us. The Rescues advise you not to get a dog from freeads etc and I wouldn't have searched for one there, the Rescues were for me, like many others, my first choice, but I can fully understand why people get dogs from other less recommended routes when too many rules are laid down by the Rescues and Shelters preventing many genuine animal lovers giving an animal a good home.

Hintza

Some interesting comments from Simon.

To which I would like to add a bit of insight (sy OP not particularly relevant) I worked in a camp in Africa and one of the village dogs had had a litter of puppies. In the early days she was very aggresive towards us but in no time discovered that "us foregieners" were a soft touch and before long she carried her pups from her den to the camp. Needless to say they thrived in this, the pups would sleep in the embers of the fire at night and were constantly singed around the edges.

As the pups got bigger the mother used to follow me through the bush and on entering a strange village would disappear only to rejoin on the other side. Village dogs are very territorial!

It ended rather sadly when a collegue of mine was going quite a distance to an other village and didn't want her to follow him and asked the locals to keep her back, this was acheived by throwing stones at her and we never saw her again. I can only suspect we had broken some sort of rule and the dog was felt to have gone beyond the pale and I suspect she met her end at their hands.

As a matter of interest the puppies were never house trained but we never ever found any dog mess in the camp.

As for bringing dogs in from abroad, I brought back two from South Africa in 1994 and the cost was over £3,500 including airfares and quarantine. It was a disaster with one having to be put down for destroying livestock. Both were very aggressive with strangers (a pre-requisite for South Africa) and other dogs. The other dog eventually died from a burst ulcer when she was 4. All in all it was not a happy time and not an experience I would like to repeat.

simontheiceman

Hintza wrote: »

As a matter of interest the puppies were never house trained but we never ever found any dog mess in the camp.

Let me answer that one for you - "village dogs" will tend to have a "midden" - a form of toilet that the group will use and this will be out of the way of the main food sources and prob somewhere discrete close to where the group sleep. The only way you would know about it is if you inadvertantly discovered it by walking through it! The pups would automatically use this midden following the example set by the mother. This is very much akin to the scenario whereby toilet training pups is greatly facilitated by other dogs in a house. Incidentally this is also the case for hyena and other wild dogs.