lowest oil prices for 12 months!! why still the increase?

1carminestocky

Lots of talk about irrational thought I see (from the usual suspect/s :rolleyes: ). OK, let's get as rational as possible:

The energy companies issued statements when oil was pushing $150 a barrel to the effect that we should expect huge price increases in gas in particular DUE TO THE PRICE OF OIL. This wasn't a statement of what was happening at that particular momnet, it was POTENTIALLY what was going to happen if oil remained at that level for a while. The rises inevitably came, followed shortly by a massive push to get people signed up to fixed tariffs (Britiah Gas even taking out HUGE ads in the national dailes to promote their deal). Fine, no problem. We were warned of these price rises in advance. Excellent.

Now then, we have a far more different scenario unfolding. Oil is off its high by almost $60 a barrel (ALMOST A 50% DECREASE) and what do the energy companies put out the press? Diddly squat, nothing, not a word. WHY NOT? Surely the portents are looking good for a huge (corresponding) DECREASE in gas prices? And SURELY we would want our socially-responsibe energy companies to TELL US ABOUT the potential for decreases (you know, like they awrned us of the POTENTIAL increases). It would be a huge shot in the arm for a public that's been constantly bashed by bad news over the last year, yes?

But the energy companies remain silent. Their silence is deafening. I wonder why? Could it be something to do with bad news being successful in selling their fixed deals? And potential good news STOPPING their little gravy train? I await a RATIONAL argument against what I'm saying. Basically, the energy companies have been caught with their pants round their ankles with this one .

KimYeovil

logie28 wrote: »

Many people will really struggle to afford energy bills this year.

Not true.

logie28 wrote: »

Unfortunately some elderly WILL once again die, deciding to heat or eat.

Not true. Every singleton over the age of 60 is entitled to £500 per month (after housing costs are paid for.) Every couple is entitled to £750. An all-the-energy-you-like tariff is available for £70 to £135 per month. No one is going to starve on £365 or £515 per month. (This does not even include the winter payments.)

logie28 wrote: »

These companies ARE in a position now to lower the price for many vulnerable people. Look at all the different tariffs.

True. But this is MoneySavingExpert.com. This community does not give a damn about fairness. I do not see an exodus toward a company like Ebico. Quite the reverse, in fact. Are YOU going to migrate to a more expensive, fairer tariff? My !!!! you will.

logie28 wrote: »

The regulatory body overseeing these companies also mentioned these companies are ripping off the vulnerable.

ibid

logie28 wrote: »

Home fuel is not a luxury in the UK . It is a NESSESITY

Keeping a single room warm when it's very cold is not a luxury. The other 95% of the time it is. Stop wasting money on luxuries (such as heating in the morning or overnight) and there'll be more than enough saved for (the very few cold snaps in) winter.

logie28 wrote: »

Here, here [sic] for our elderly and vulnerable this winter... GOOD LUCK.

ibid

superstylin

Maybe it's about to start coming down again? my local total garage has just decreased it's price from £105.9 to £102.9. I had to look twice incase there was something wrong with my eyes, being as the other garages are still at least £104.9

mech_2

logie28 wrote: »

Many countries around the world pay less than the u.k for gas and electric.
the WORLD market on these commodities is basically the same.

Well I'm afraid that is just plain wrong. Gas and electricity markets are strongly localised. It's just not possible for the UK to import electricity from another continent. We can't import piped gas from outside the European market either. Most of our imported gas comes from Norway or Russia.

The UK can import a relatively small portion of our gas by tanker as LNG (liquified natural gas), but there's a limited capacity to unload and store it. There's also a 15% loss of gas in the process (the ships engines run on the gas and it is used as a refrigerant to keep itself liquified). So the fact that American prices are much lower (for example) is of limited benefit. We can't get at it. We're tied to continental prices on the whole.

Many people will really struggle to afford energy bills this year.

Unfortunately some elderly WILL once again die, deciding to heat or eat.

These companies ARE in a position now to lower the price for many vulnerable people. Look at all the different tariffs.

I see you have been reading the tabloids. Frankly I can't see a correlation between winter deaths and energy prices. Energy prices more than doubled between winter 2002/2003 and winter 2006/2007 but winter morbidity stayed about the same. I would suggest that elderly people will tend to die in the winter whatever the price of energy. You can't expect all of them to stay indoors all winter, neither can you expect them to heat their houses to a higher temperature if they have no central heating. That's what Warm Front grants are all about. And at least the elderly get a winter fuel allowance!

To be honest I don't think the malcontents trying to take the moral high ground care about the elderly at all. They think that they can effect change by petulant moaning and hope to gain lower fuel bills for themselves by rustling up public pressure on the government to magically make their bills go away. I think this is delusional. Energy is still cheap at current prices. I only see a small subset of the population limiting their usage. Most people are happy to continue to waste energy and then moan about their bills afterwards.

The regulatory body overseeing these companies also mentioned these companies are ripping off the vulnerable.

Yes. That is true. Prepay meters have been a rip off for far too long. But it has nothing to do with the price of oil.

The government has immediately put pressure on these companies to pass savings on to companies immediately. Just after the government ruled out windfall taxes on these greedy unethical thieves.

If you want lower energy bills lobby government to tax the energy companies less, not more. Increase their overheads, increase prices. Dead simple.

Any one who sympathises with these including the shareholders who wish for a cold winter for huge dividends are a disgrace.(in my opinion)

I'm not sure how a cold winter generates more profits for domestic energy companies though. A cold winter pushes up demand, which drives up wholesale prices. The likes of Gazprom, Statoil and BP would benefit, but none of these entities set retail prices.

The Met office has forecast another mild winter. But I confidently predict the British will claim it's incredibly incredibly cold regardless.

Home fuel is not a luxury in the UK . It is a NESSESITY...

Dont give me the c£rap about oil prices not affecting gas prices! It is all we have heard the big six spout for the last 12 months..

Here, here for our elderly and vulnerable this winter... GOOD LUCK.

Only 1carminestocky believes oil prices do not affect gas prices as far as I can tell. Everyone else is just being impatient.

gilfachboy

I'm shocked at what i have been reading on here. All you who are sticking up for the gas/elec companies are either employed within the industry or are involved in the financial sector for making statements like you are making. The facts of the matter is that oil prices have dipped to under $80 a barrel (that is fact) That was the excuse the gas/elec was using when they upped the price of gas/elec Fact. Its people like you who are working in the financial sector that we the tax payers are now having to bail out. So dont come on here spouting your city slicker talk on here with your big words and figures trying to convince us that the price hikes had nothing to do with the price of oil.

1carminestocky

gilfachboy wrote: »

I'm shocked at what i have been reading on here. All you who are sticking up for the gas/elec companies are either employed within the industry or are involved in the financial sector for making statements like you are making. The facts of the matter is that oil prices have dipped to under $80 a barrel (that is fact) That was the excuse the gas/elec was using when they upped the price of gas/elec Fact. Its people like you who are working in the financial sector that we the tax payers are now having to bail out. So dont come on here spouting your city slicker talk on here with your big words and figures trying to convince us that the price hikes had nothing to do with the price of oil.

Many of them ARE employed by the energy companies, certainly the most vocal one in this thread, Mech, is. Problem is he and others on here are flouting forum rules continuously by NOT making it clear they make their living from the industry. You'd think if they are so proud to work for these companies (they certainly like sticking up for them) they'd be only too happy to make it clear they work for them. The fact they don't speaks volumes...


Edit: PS. Just read Mech's latest outburst and I have to say he's totally lost the plot. He clearly toes the company line by holding the public in such low esteem. Mech and the energy industry are made for each other, basically...

Mech said:

Only 1carminestocky believes oil prices do not affect gas prices as far as I can tell. Everyone else is just being impatient.

Huh?? Puzzling first line, but I'm assuming you are AGAIN saying that gas prices are due a decrease? Why can't your bosses come out and say this, then? I think we all know the reasons why they don't, don't we? BTW, would you still advise people to take out a fixed deal at the moment? Just curious...

mech_2

Dammit, wrong button.

1carminestocky wrote: »

Many of them ARE employed by the energy companies, certainly the most vocal one in this thread, Mech, is. Problem is he and others on here are flouting forum rules continuously by NOT making it clear they make their living from the industry.

Firstly: I am aware of no such rule. And secondly: no I'm not.

You'd think if they are so proud to work for these companies (they certainly like sticking up for them) they'd be only too happy to make it clear they work for them. The fact they don't speaks volumes...

One could say the same of you and Utility Warehouse.

Edit: PS. Just read Mech's latest outburst and I have to say he's totally lost the plot. He clearly toes the company line by holding the public in such low esteem. Mech and the energy industry are made for each other, basically...

Please point out a factual error.

Mech said:

Only 1carminestocky believes oil prices do not affect gas prices as far as I can tell. Everyone else is just being impatient.

Huh?? Puzzling first line,

Well you have repeatedly treated the connection with scepticism. It's a "line" and a "story". Or are you saying you have changed your mind?

but I'm assuming you are AGAIN saying that gas prices are due a decrease? Why can't your bosses come out and say this, then?

I thought I made it quite clear. Retail gas prices will come down if wholesale prices come down. If oil prices don't go back up again, wholesale prices are likely to fall. After a few months retail price reductions would then seem feasible. Unfortunately no one knows for sure what the prices of oil and gas will do, so nothing can be declared for certain. Not by me, not by energy companies and not by fictional bosses.

I think we all know the reasons why they don't, don't we? BTW, would you still advise people to take out a fixed deal at the moment? Just curious...

Why do I continually have to repeat myself with you people? No I wouldn't. I said "it's a bit late now" more than once.

Fixed deals are only worth it if you think variable tariffs will increase in price. I don't currently think that's very probable, so no. I wouldn't. I would not recommend that. I do not think it's a good idea. Capiche?

morgan

Moonrakerz, do you work in the energy industry?

Gone quiet...I think you hit a nerve there!!!:p

1carminestocky

Mech, I believe, works for British Gas and is of the opinion that prices will come down in the New Year and he wouldn't advise anybody to take out a fixed deal now. Here's his company's 'offers' page:

http://www.britishgas.co.uk/ouroffers


Headline ad??

2012.

smidgey

1carminestocky wrote: »

Mech, I believe, works for British Gas and is of the opinion that prices will come down in the New Year and he wouldn't advise anybody to take out a fixed deal now. Here's his company's 'offers' page:

http://www.britishgas.co.uk/ouroffers


Headline ad??

2012.

I wouldn't and never do regardless of what is happening with oil prices.

I would advise the same as I advise any customer. If YOU want the peace of mind that your prices will not change until 2012 then this is for you. HOWEVER you pay a 7.4% premium, get no DD discount, have to pay a cancellation fee if you want to come off it PLUS if the rates come down, yours will not.

No horror stories about prices rising because I do not know if they will go up or if they will go down. I get told on the day a price change happens.

So although I wouldn't recommend the tariff it's not because I expect prices to fall but because I don't generally recommend tariffs! I give the facts and let the consumer decide on what is best for them.