'Icesave... angry, frustrated and upset...' blog discussion

bubbles4141

We have interest that would have been due soon, but obviouly not shown on our staement. If we do not get this money we will be very much out of pocket. It was planned to pay a tax bill in November. Will we get any interest on the account that is due.

RealityCheck_2

ThrobsBlackHat wrote: »

That is the job of a financial advisor - not an internet community.

This site has never recommended investing in anything. It merely stated which of the products had the highest return at the time, which is publicly available information and saved time for site users.

Risk is not publicly known, is subject to all sorts of fluctuations and is often based on opinion more than anything else. All a "best buy" table does is compare the "best buy" rates on accounts which are publically available.

I think that much of the MSE community need to wake up and smell the coffee. No doubt Martin is reflecting on the consequences of the C4 interview, and it would come as no surprise if you see some changes to MSE website in light of the far reaching consequences its content can have. On balance, I doubt that Martin ever intended these consequences, but it has been clear to me having watched Martin for some time now that he has taken certain financial issues too far and strayed in to domains where we all have thoughts and opinions, but where these can be taken as implict advice due to the scale of the following he has built up and the audience he has reached.

He quite rightly highlights and works for the benefit of those on lower incomes and with restricted finances, many of whom have been rich pickings for certain utilities and financial instutions for many years now. Martin's influence in these areas is quite clearly positive for the consumer and these industries as a whole, stimulating competition and improving the offering to the end user.

However, when it comes to financial services products, albeit something that as straighforward as bank accounts, this is an area where Martin must refrain from making any implied recommendation whatsoever. This is consitutes advice, whatever the disclaimer and this is an area which is regulated and MSE must obtain the necessary permissions and importantly insurances if Martin wishes to be active in this area.

For those who do not think Martin makes recommendations, pls read last night's blog http://blog.moneysavingexpert.com/ However unwittingly, this is an admission of what i'm sure Martin must now take on board and adjust his public commentary accordingly. Again, I doubt this was ever his intent, but it reflects the areas his commentary has now encroached in to. If a full post-mortem were done, we all know that the line between informing people and providing advice has become blurred both on MSE and through the Martin Lewis PR machine.

This is not about Martin bashing, as he occupies an important space. There is no substitute for proper financial advice, but the economics involved preclude those on smaller incomes and more limited asset bases from meeting the accompanying costs.

I would simply suggest that Martin reigns himself in, which does not have to impede the valuable work that he does.

CathieG

I had been thinking of you Sandra - and when I heard Alasdair Darling on radio this morning, I knew what a weight this must be off your shoulders! I think the Government has acted well today and it's great this has been done with cross party support. There will be more difficult days ahead - as pension funds assess the damage etc. But it's time for the country to stick together, calm jangled nerves and sort out some of the mess. It would be good if the BBC could start by saying something positive about this country. I'm sick of listening to their constant put downs.

dazmb

Fair play to Alistair Darling/Gordo for an act of nobelness (is that a word?) that they did not legally have to do by guaranteeing all monies for UK peeps :T :T
I'm so impressed I may even vote for them now. And that's saying something as I bloody hate Labour

However, my feeling of contempt for the Icelandic financial system and their government knows no limits! So, they are not going to be honourable eh? We'll see about that.....

The simple things for everybody to do are a) not go on holiday to Iceland ever again b) send an email to the Icelandic PM informing him to not close his eyes at night as we are coming over to burn his house down :eek: (joking - but only a bit..)

But more actions could include (in order of severity):

1- Send a gun boat over and shell the living cr*p out of them
2- Poison all their fish stocks with arsenic as that's all they ever eat and it will be a slow lingering death for them all
3- Use Iceland as a worldwide authorised nuclear bomb testing site
4- Get the Icesave execs and the government in a room together and make them listen to a continuous loop of the entire back catalogue of Bjork

Or perhaps all four at once

painted_scotty

I transferred money form my Kaupthing Edge Account last night (7 Oct 2008) by CHAPS transfer. The money was immediately shown as having gone my KE account and there was a £20 charge onn the account for the CHAPS transfer. However, the money has not gone into my receiving account. I phoned them tonight and got no help whatsoever. They told me that they did not know where the money had gone and were no in a position to trace it. What to do now? Has anyone any similar experience? If teh money was showing in one of my accounts but I just couldn't move it for the moment I wouldn't feel so bad, but for it not to be showing in any accounts and getting that response from KE it is very worrying.

yinhong

Pandini wrote: »

This site has been almost guilty of giving the message that "yes, this is a riskier investment, but banks never go bust, so don't worry".

Don't put words into Martin's mouth. That's not what he said, and I think you know that you're spinning it in the light of the current situation.

I think any rational person would know that he gave the most ACCURATE advice that he believed he could at the time (which, incidentally, was the same as pretty much everyone else...IN THE WORLD.)

However, I also believe that every individual responsibility, rather than just placing blame at one source (why is it that the world always seems to think that there's only 1 source of blame for everything?). So yes, that means that I believe Martin should feel a small degree of responsibility, which I think he is. But so should we. So we should all just try and do the best that we can, as individuals, rather than just shifting responsibility to easy targets. This is EVERYBODY'S fault and the whole situation would be better off if we all just took individual responsibility.

cvd

And if anyone did take their financial advice from an internet forum they would have heard warnings for MONTHS to not have more than £35k in any one institution.

I agree that this advice has often been given in this forum, but I think it is very poor advice. The advice should surely have been: "Rule 1: always spread your savings between several places whatever the guarantees say; rule2: keep the amount in any one place less than £35k (now £50k)".

dazmb

RealityCheck wrote: »

I think that much of the MSE community need to wake up and smell the coffee. No doubt Martin is reflecting on the consequences of the C4 interview, and it would come as no surprise if you see some changes to MSE website in light of the far reaching consequences its content can have. On balance, I doubt that Martin ever intended these consequences, but it has been clear to me having watched Martin for some time now that he has taken certain financial issues too far and strayed in to domains where we all have thoughts and opinions, but where these can be taken as implict advice due to the scale of the following he has built up and the audience he has reached.

He quite rightly highlights and works for the benefit of those on lower incomes and with restricted finances, many of whom have been rich pickings for certain utilities and financial instutions for many years now. Martin's influence in these areas is quite clearly positive for the consumer and these industries as a whole, stimulating competition and improving the offering to the end user.

However, when it comes to financial services products, albeit something that as straighforward as bank accounts, this is an area where Martin must refrain from making any implied recommendation whatsoever. This is consitutes advice, whatever the disclaimer and this is an area which is regulated and MSE must obtain the necessary permissions and importantly insurances if Martin wishes to be active in this area.

For those who do not think Martin makes recommendations, pls read last night's blog http://blog.moneysavingexpert.com/ However unwittingly, this is an admission of what i'm sure Martin must now take on board and adjust his public commentary accordingly. Again, I doubt this was ever his intent, but it reflects the areas his commentary has now encroached in to. If a full post-mortem were done, we all know that the line between informing people and providing advice has become blurred both on MSE and through the Martin Lewis PR machine.

This is not about Martin bashing, as he occupies an important space. There is no substitute for proper financial advice, but the economics involved preclude those on smaller incomes and more limited asset bases from meeting the accompanying costs.

I would simply suggest that Martin reigns himself in, which does not have to impede the valuable work that he does.

If I understand your point, it seems to me that it is close to social correctness gone stark raving mad! Correct me if i'm wrong, but you are saying in effect that Martin can never ever again make any recommendations for something that implies financial gain or best value as he can't expect/rely on people to take personal responsibility for their decisions if something goes wrong even if he has given a balanced view including any concerns (like he did with Icesave).

So what if for example, a company has a promotional offer on a financial services product which relies on people purchasing in a set period of time in return for an increased financial benefit, and that company goes bust (or it's a fraud) and people lose out financially? Should Martin not highlight this offer for fear of something going wrong? Martin can't predict the future, or way up all the risks involved. That comes back to personal ownership of one's actions/choices after having taken advice.

This is all modern PC madness, and IMO explains a great deal about the current woes in our society. A society where people are always wanting to blame someone else - with the blame equalling some sort of personal compensation for our own mistakes in life! And we all make those mistakes. Every one of us at some time or other. No-one could have forseen Iceland as a nation going bust, or help what has happened to Icesave. None of the savers are to blame, and neither is ML responsible for all the savers who signed on the dotted line.

If Martin makes people aware of obvious risks as he did with Icesave there is no reason I can see why he can't make recommendations in good faith.

Don't forget, MANY MANY magazines/institutions/financial websites touted Icesave as a best in class product (including Which?).

I fear your suggestion would leave people with no advice, or even worse deliberate bad advice.

tomterm8

cvd wrote: »

I agree that this advice has often been given in this forum, but I think it is very poor advice. The advice should surely have been: "Rule 1: always spread your savings between several places whatever the guarantees say; rule2: keep the amount in any one place less than £35k (now £50k)".

with respect, hindsight is a wonderful thing, but the risks of a bank in the developed world collapsing prior to the current debacle was so low that martin can be excused for missing a credit crunch which is more severe than any since the 1930s.

I mean, it's not even like his advice was wrong, UK savers who kept to his advice have not lost anything. :money:

I must admit, I've always been paranoid, and have a months wages in a national savings account, and another months wages in an account with a foreign bank:rotfl: But then again I am an historian, and realise that these things come around every 80 years or so:p

MORPH3US

People on here really need to wake up...

I know it must be very difficult facing the prospect of losing a little or a lot of money, but this IS NOT MARTIN'S FAULT....

Everyone on this site makes their own decisions and needs to take responsibility for those decisions.

I am fortunate enough to not be affected by these finance problems at the moment, but god forbid they do affect me, I will not be blaming Martin.

To Martin - please don't let these problems change you or MSE. I love you both (in man to man, bear hug and firm pat on the back way, nothing else)...

M