Jamie Oliver; Ministry of Food

Churchmouse

Oh I know it's a matter of taste that puts you off SCs:D I suppose I use less liquid to start with, and because I "sweat" the veggies and brown the meat before they go in, they don't really need as much actual cooking as some others. Just as well, because I'm a "lid-lifter" (I know, I know, that's a no-no:rotfl: ) which also lets some liquid evaporate each time. There's no way I can leave it alone for 6 or more hours:o

Anwen_2

pinknfluffy wrote: »

The lady with the children who ate off of the floor like animals

It's a shame there isn't a 'no thanks' button, because this post was absolutely disgusting, along with several others (though I'm glad to see there have been nearly as many posts pointing out how wrong they are...)

There but for the grace of God and all that, eh? There is no actual moral advantage to eating at a table, you know! It's a cultural thing and nothing more. And yes, it's depressing that so many people live off takeaways when other options would probably be cheaper and better for them, but you know what? Not everyone has had the same chances in life as you. Not everyone has the same resources as you. Not everyone has the same priorities as you - in many cases it may be as 'simple' as a vicious circle of not knowing how to cook much, not having the resources to learn and having the impression that it is something terribly complicated (because whatever we may know to the contrary, the supermarkets and so on have helped to build the impression that yes, actually, cooking is terribly complex and far too difficult for Ordinary Folks) which leads to eating overpriced crap which leads to having less energy and money to start trying to do proper cooking (because if you have never done proper cooking you probably don't have much in the way of even basic utensils or storecupboard) which leads to eating overpriced crap which means less energy and so on.

And to be honest, this stupid snobbish 'omg they were EATING ON THE FLOOR!!' is probably a major part of why a lot of people end up in this circle - if you not only have to figure out how to do the cooking, find the space and energy to do it (and the resultant washing up and the preceding shopping) but also you find out that even then, if you aren't sitting at a Proper Table with Proper Table Manners, you're still Not Good Enough, well, it's rather demoralising, no? And you know what, not everyone has a Proper Table or enough chairs.

Anwen_2

shazrobo wrote: »

i am also a single mum on benefits right now, and there is no way we can afford takeaways like they did, we buy them about 3 or 4 times a year max.
i also suffer from really bad depression and anxiety, and not always up to cooking a 'proper' dinner, those days, we have jacket spud and beans, or pasta, which is so easy, and healthier than takeaways, there really is no excuse

I don't really want to say this, as it is not up to me to diagnose you, but if you only have 'some days' where you can't manage 'a proper dinner' but on those days you can still manage to cook SOMETHING then your depression (as horrible as it obviously is for you) isn't anywhere near as bad as it gets. Really severe depression results in more or less a catatonic state, and many people with severe depression (but not quite to the catatonic level) can't feed or bathe themselves properly. So just because you have 'really bad' depression, don't you dare assume that you know all about how bad it can get, and say that there's No Excuse. Also, what about those of us who have the lucky experience of having both severe depressive illness and physical disability as well, or just the physical disability?

ETA: oh, and fwiw, I am a very good cook, thanks largely to my ex who was rather shocked when I proudly made him spag bol consisting of, er, some passata and mince and not much else. I was also a very fussy eater when I ate him, and now I eat quite a lot of veg and everything! But anyway, yes, I am good at making food which is tasty, but I have fibromyalgia which = constant fatigue which can easily be turned into exhaustion and indeed total physical collapse, accompanied by severe and random pain, IBS and other fun things. I also have ADD which makes it very hard to plan/be organised/etc. So all in all, it is a huge struggle for me to do proper cooking on a regular basis, in spite of being good at it and even really rather enjoying it. I have far too often had the horribly upsetting experience of managing to make a proper casserole or soup or whatever at the weekend, and then having to throw half of the planned-leftovers away because I have been too exhausted to actually manage the seemingly simple task of reheating some of whatever it was.

And as I say, I have the enormous advantage of knowing how to cook very nice things for fairly cheap, as well as living within walking distance of two 'mainstream' supermarkets, a really good Turkish supermarket, a Lidl etc. and generally of being quite intelligent and so on. I live in a council flat, and am on a greatly reduced income due to being on SSP at the moment and on minimal hours when I go back to work.

MrsE_2

Anwen wrote: »

It's a shame there isn't a 'no thanks' button, because this post was absolutely disgusting, along with several others (though I'm glad to see there have been nearly as many posts pointing out how wrong they are...)

There but for the grace of God and all that, eh? There is no actual moral advantage to eating at a table, you know! It's a cultural thing and nothing more. And yes, it's depressing that so many people live off takeaways when other options would probably be cheaper and better for them, but you know what? Not everyone has had the same chances in life as you. Not everyone has the same resources as you. Not everyone has the same priorities as you - in many cases it may be as 'simple' as a vicious circle of not knowing how to cook much, not having the resources to learn and having the impression that it is something terribly complicated (because whatever we may know to the contrary, the supermarkets and so on have helped to build the impression that yes, actually, cooking is terribly complex and far too difficult for Ordinary Folks) which leads to eating overpriced crap which leads to having less energy and money to start trying to do proper cooking (because if you have never done proper cooking you probably don't have much in the way of even basic utensils or storecupboard) which leads to eating overpriced crap which means less energy and so on.

And to be honest, this stupid snobbish 'omg they were EATING ON THE FLOOR!!' is probably a major part of why a lot of people end up in this circle - if you not only have to figure out how to do the cooking, find the space and energy to do it (and the resultant washing up and the preceding shopping) but also you find out that even then, if you aren't sitting at a Proper Table with Proper Table Manners, you're still Not Good Enough, well, it's rather demoralising, no? And you know what, not everyone has a Proper Table or enough chairs.

When you've quite got down off your high horse, that lady is the one with the giant plasma & the snazzy cooker, she also HAS a table & chairs in her kitchen & like her cooker she CHOOSES not to use them:D

Of course some people don't have a table & chairs or the room for it, but I'm pretty sure they would accomodate their children on the sofa with a tray or dinner table.

Maybe it is cultural, but I find the sight of a child eating their main evening meal out of a box on the floor with their fingers every night as a matter of routine not nice.

Christ, I even have my cats bowls on a little tray!

I wonder if she sits on the floor & eats with her hands:rolleyes:

lindadykes

I work as a special needs teacher in a secondary school and have to say that as time goes by I feel that the education system and curriculum fails those who are less academically able. I have worked with some delightful young people who have worked hard given their all and struggled yet have still left school with a reading age of 7 because at that reading age they have reached their full potential. Even so these students are still expected to be entered for and take GCSE's in English, Maths and Science plus sometimes other subjects. The holy grail in education is 5 A* to C's. Students who don't make this are often made to seem failures - even if they have worked hard and achieved the best that they can. We don't teach life skills. food Technology has nothing to do with home cooking. I doubt my great grandma would have achieved 5 A* - C's in the current curriculum but she was the most wonderful cook. She brought up six children on a healthy wholesome diet. My great grandfather was a miner, but when he wasn't working, with the help of his sons he grew their own veg. My great gran baked not only basics but the most wonderful fresh cream cakes and tea cakes. Sadly my nana - her daughter in law could burn water, but my mum learned how to cook from my great grandma.

I didn't learn initially to cook from my mum as she often felt I got under her feet, so didn't really teach me, however when I got pregnant at 17 and moved into my own house I turned to her when my initial attempts were disasters and she pointed me in the right direction. Following the break up of my first "shotgun" marriage I married again, but unfortunately this husband was an alcoholic who despite earning reasonable wages spent them all down the local with his mates. I had three more children and quickly learned that I had to stretch food. I learned how to perfect breadmaking as I couldn't afford to buy commercially produced bread.

There is only 15 months between my two eldest daughters and they needed a huge heavy double buggy. I didn't drive at the time so every Monday I walked 2 miles to the town centre with my babies in their double buggy so that I could collect my child benefit and then visit the market for cheap fruit, veg and fish. I would then visit "joblot" an outlet that sold stuff close to or out of sell by dates. We would pop in the park to eat some pre prepared food I would take for lunch, then I would push my heavily laden buggy uphill the 2 miles home - so I really don't have much sympathy for the I don't have money for the bus.

When my eyes were finally opened I left my husband and I and my 4 children lived in rented furnished accomodation on benefits and I felt rich! I was so used to my husband spending the bulk of the money on booze in six months on income support I saved £600!

I vowed I would never be dependent on a man for money again - I decided to apply to go to university to train to be a teacher. Around this time I met my present husband and even though he has never wanted children of his own he has made a fantastic step dad, my now grown up children always tell him how much they appreciate the support he has given them over the years.

I know this is a little long winded but I want to make the point that I am not coming to this from a privledged point of view and have "been there".

I agree that JO's recipes are a little too complicated, ambitious and expensive. I applaude his sentiments and think he really is a great guy, but he really doesn't have a clue about how "the other half live". That said someone needs to speak out and try to make a difference and the politicians don't do it so hats off to Jamie at least he is bringing these issues into the light and making people aware of them.

Rachel021967

Anwen wrote: »

I
I was also a very fussy eater when I ate him,

Was he tasty? I also suffer from severe depression, but no physical problems, and from the time I buy the food to coming down to cook it I really don't have the energy and cook something from the freezer or cook pasta and sauce. So I waste a lot of food.

I look forward to the watching the programme.

HariboJunkie

Anwen wrote: »

I don't really want to say this, as it is not up to me to diagnose you, but if you only have 'some days' where you can't manage 'a proper dinner' but on those days you can still manage to cook SOMETHING then your depression (as horrible as it obviously is for you) isn't anywhere near as bad as it gets. Really severe depression results in more or less a catatonic state, and many people with severe depression (but not quite to the catatonic level) can't feed or bathe themselves properly. So just because you have 'really bad' depression, don't you dare assume that you know all about how bad it can get, and say that there's No Excuse. Also, what about those of us who have the lucky experience of having both severe depressive illness and physical disability as well, or just the physical disability?

.

You're right. It isn't. :rolleyes: So maybe you just should have stopped there.

Anwen_2

MrsE wrote: »

When you've quite got down off your high horse, that lady is the one with the giant plasma & the snazzy cooker, she also HAS a table & chairs in her kitchen & like her cooker she CHOOSES not to use them:D

Of course some people don't have a table & chairs or the room for it, but I'm pretty sure they would accomodate their children on the sofa with a tray or dinner table.

Maybe it is cultural, but I find the sight of a child eating their main evening meal out of a box on the floor with their fingers every night as a matter of routine not nice.

Christ, I even have my cats bowls on a little tray!

I wonder if she sits on the floor & eats with her hands:rolleyes:

And you have totally missed the point. There is NO MORAL SUPERIORITY in eating at a sodding table. Maybe her chlidren DON'T LIKE sitting at the table, maybe the kitchen is COLD. Just because you've seen a tiny glimpse of their life on the bloody telly, doesn't mean you know anything about them.

If it makes you feel good to convince yourself that you are superior to someone because you eat at a table then go right ahead, but that seems pretty pathetic to me.

I liked AA Gill's take on the show:

http://entertainment.timesonline.co.uk/tol/arts_and_entertainment/tv_and_radio/article4867579.ece

(about a third of the way down the page, after the Little Britain stuff)

Anwen_2

HariboJunkie wrote: »

You're right. It isn't. :rolleyes: So maybe you just should have stopped there.

Oh well, if people go round saying they have 'really bad depression' and therefore know that it is 'no excuse' for basically anything, then I kind of feel that I have the right (as someone who actually has major depressive illness) to point out that actually 'really bad depression' is horrible but not nearly as bad as it gets, and also that it's not an excuse for anything, it's a reason.

Anwen_2

Rachel021967 wrote: »

Anwen wrote: »

I
I was also a very fussy eater when I ate him,

Was he tasty?

Rofl! Oh dear... I would like to state for the record that I did not in fact consume my ex, who is safe and well and living in Denmark...

Sorry to hear about your illness, it sucks, doesn't it?