Bond problems=Threatening tenant

fishergirl_2

I rented out my house for 6 months as I went to teach overseas. My house was immaculate-only 3 yrs old. I cleaned it from top to bottom before I left but didn't do an inventory though (it was unfurnished). Walked round with the tenant and we both agreed that the only main blemish was a black scuff mark on my bedroom wall.
They've been nightmare tenants with paying the rent-the last 3 months have been 3 weeks late but I've not charged them interest of threatened them (they've always had 'plausible' excuses!)

Anyhow, they moved out today and I went round to do the check before I moved back in and gave them their bond back. There are tons of grease splats on the kitchen wall (and I mean loads!) and the grill pan is a write off-it doesn't look like they've cleaned it since they arrived! Floors haven't been mopped and there is still wee on the underside of the toilet seats. My back garden is like a jungle and there is dog mess on the lawn from their dog.
I've been very patient with them but this really annoyed and upset me!

I wrote out a receipt for their bond and kept £125 for the work and materials that needed doing and dropped this and the money round to them. The man came round my house then shouting and swearing at me. Have I been unreasonable??

Sorry for the long message!

Willsnarf1983

short answer no

Will

Lavendyr

Lesson for next time = do an inventory! Without one you have no proof of the state the house was in originally. If the tenant was to take you to court, you would have trouble proving the dilapidations.

Did you protect the deposit in one of the schemes as is legally required? If so, any deductions should have been agreed through the scheme.

tbs624

fishergirl wrote: »

I rented out my house for 6 months as I went to teach overseas. My house was immaculate-only 3 yrs old. I cleaned it from top to bottom before I left but didn't do an inventory though (it was unfurnished). Walked round with the tenant and we both agreed that the only main blemish was a black scuff mark on my bedroom wall.
They've been nightmare tenants with paying the rent-the last 3 months have been 3 weeks late but I've not charged them interest of threatened them (they've always had 'plausible' excuses!)

(my own highlighting) It’s just as well that you have not “threatened them” - you could be looking at a criminal charge otherwise.

If you are in Eng/Wales and you received the deposit after 6 April 2007, you should, as Lavendyr says, have protected their tenancy deposit by scheme-registering it. You would also be required to give them the “prescribed information” on the scheme. LLs who do neither of these things can be ordered by a court to either return the deposit in full or register it immediately (where the tenancy is still current) plus pay an amount equivalent to 3x the deposit to the tenant.

fishergirl wrote: »

Anyhow, they moved out today and I went round to do the check before I moved back in and gave them their bond back. There are tons of grease splats on the kitchen wall (and I mean loads!) and the grill pan is a write off-it doesn't look like they've cleaned it since they arrived! Floors haven't been mopped and there is still wee on the underside of the toilet seats. My back garden is like a jungle and there is dog mess on the lawn from their dog.

As you were abroad you would have been required to have a UK-based agent's address whilst you were out of the country: did you, and was this person supposed to make any inspections of the property during the tenancy?

fishergirl wrote: »

I've been very patient with them but this really annoyed and upset me!

If you didn’t have that UK agent’s address in place for the service of Notices then no rent was legally collectable until such an address was given - if you didn’t cover this requirement then you are perhaps lucky that the rent has been paid out albeit late.It probably would have been better for you to arrange to visit in the last week of their tenancy so that you could have clarified what you would like the tenants to do, & given them chance to sort things out.

fishergirl wrote: »

I wrote out a receipt for their bond and kept £125 for the work and materials that needed doing and dropped this and the money round to them. The man came round my house then shouting and swearing at me. Have I been unreasonable??

Bear in mind that you will need to show any deposit retention on your tax return.

It’s absolutely not right that tenants should leave a property in anything except a similar state to as at the start of the tenancy, FW&T excepted. However, you cannot simply make deductions from a tenant's deposit without properly justifying your costs and you should have written to the tenant explaining what you want to deduct and why, enclosing two or three quotes for the work: they can challenge you if they think they have grounds to do so.

If you don’t have an inventory in place from the start of the tenancy you would probably struggle to justify any deductions in a court, however unfair that may seem to you. Additionally, if you did not register that deposit ( but should have done) then you have failed to comply with your own legal obligations under the Housing Act 2004.

Captain_Mainwaring_2

(my own highlighting) It’s just as well that you have not “threatened them” - you could be looking at a criminal charge otherwise.

I think you will find that the OP was refering to not have threatened the tenant with an interest charge rather than physical violence, but hey, don't let that stop you going off on your predictable rant.

Need to show deposit retention on the tax return? Why? are you a tax inspector now? The LL will be using that money to correct the damage , therefore there is no gain to account for.

As you were abroad you would have been required to have a UK-based agent's address whilst you were out of the country: did you, and was this person supposed to make any inspections of the property during the tenancy?

No you are NOT required to have a UK based agent, I've been an overseas landlord for over 15 years now and my tenants have a UK number they can call and my email address, no agents involved, and no requirement for one.

tbs624

Captain_Mainwaring wrote: »

I think you will find that the OP was refering to not have threatened the tenant with an interest charge rather than physical violence, but hey, don't let that stop you going off on your predictable rant.

If you find it predictable and don't want to read it then simply hit the ignore button

“Threats” amounting to harassment are not confined to physical violence.No LL should be threatening a tenant with anything: it’s worth making that point IMO for any other readers of the thread who may similarly find the OP’s wording questionable.(And, if we are talking about interest charges ,let's add that the LL can't just pluck a figure out of the air.)

Captain_Mainwaring wrote: »

Need to show deposit retention on the tax return? Why? are you a tax inspector now? The LL will be using that money to correct the damage , therefore there is no gain to account for.

You say that you run a business and yet don’t seem to think you a/c for moneys in and moneys out when working out your tax return? :think:

Captain_Mainwaring wrote: »

No you are NOT required to have a UK based agent, I've been an overseas landlord for over 15 years now and my tenants have a UK number they can call and my email address, no agents involved, and no requirement for one.

Now who is on a rant? You stick with your own interpretation of the law CM - some day you’ll come up against a tenant who knows his/her way round it all better than you do and you’ll come seriously unstuck. Do post here and let us all know how you get on : we need a really good laugh now and then.

A UK phone number and an email address are not sufficient: you may care to peruse the Landlord & Tenant 1987 Act S48
Notification by landlord of address for service of notices.

(1) A landlord of premises to which this Part applies shall by notice furnish the tenant with an address in England and Wales at which notices (including notices in proceedings) may be served on him by the tenant.

(2) Where a landlord of any such premises fails to comply with subsection (1), any rent or service charge otherwise due from the tenant to the landlord shall (subject to subsection (3)) be treated for all purposes as not being due from the tenant to the landlord at any time before the landlord does comply with that subsection.

(3) Any such rent or service charge shall not be so treated in relation to any time when, by virtue of an order of any court, there is in force an appointment of a receiver or manager whose functions include the receiving of rent or (as the case may be) service charges from the tenant.

Was that predictable too?

clutton_2

i think you will find that under certain taxation situations the tenants have a legal duty to deduct your income tax from their rent if you are living abroad - best to talk to the Revenue if anyone is thinking of becoming an overseas LL

poppy10_2

fishergirl wrote: »

My house was immaculate-only 3 yrs old. I cleaned it from top to bottom before I left but didn't do an inventory though (it was unfurnished).

This is the problem with a lot of amateur landlords. You can't expect to get it back in pristine condition - it's not a showhome. No inventory=no deductions, especially for things like "wee on the underside of the toilet seat" Hand the money back quickly before you get sued.

fishergirl_2

Reading some of the replies it makes me seem as if i'm a bully who goes round threatening tenants!:o I didn't mean it to sound like that! I'm a quiet single girl who just wanted to teach in a different country for a couple of months!

Anyway-character rebuilding aside :-) I paid a local estate agent to find the tenants for me and they ran the credit checks and drew up the enancy agreement so everything is above board in that sense. I was only abroad for 4 months so didn't need to pay any tax or notify the tax office (looked into that as well).

With regards to charging them interest-there is a paragraph in the tenancy agreement which says that if the tenant is late paying their rent, then I'm entitled to charge them interest on the outstanding balance. It also said that if they were over 3 weeks late paying (which they were) then I could have threatened them with eviction. That's what I meant by the 'threatening'them part - sorry I didn't make myself clear!

I told the tenants that they had to leave the house in the same condtition as when they moved in when I called in after I got back so they had ample opportunity to remedy things then i.e. the wall, missing bulbs etc.

I typed up a list and costs as well of the things I had to fix and signed it and gave them a copy so is this ok?
Thanks for the replies!

Premier_2

Lavendyr wrote: »

Lesson for next time = do an inventory! Without one you have no proof of the state the house was in originally. If the tenant was to take you to court, you would have trouble proving the dilapidations...

As would the tenant proving the dilapidations were not their responsibility.

In this case the LL has the money owed, so the tenant would need to prove they had a case to answer.

Remember, an inventory/statement of condition is in the interest of both the landlord and tenant.

clutton_2

"" It also said that if they were over 3 weeks late paying (which they were) then I could have threatened them with eviction. " - no - just utterly wrong.

sorry fisher girl - you seem to have been given all the wrong advice - but they have moved on now - so if you are going to let again - find an agent who is a member of ARLA and get a professional to work for you