Full and final settlement help thread

poppasmurf_2

Both of those are now settled. Hurrah. That was with Cabot.

Now I have a problem with Pra Group requested my CCA .... I received a reconstituted CCA but no signed agreement. They sent a letter to say it is unenforceable. But still to pay. 

I said no. 

This is the reply

"Hi C

Thank you for your response. 

Agreements provided do not have to be the original documents, a reconstituted agreement is deemed as being acceptable to our regulators and does not have to contain signatures or be the actual signed agreement. You can get further info on the CCA website around acceptable reconstituted agreements www.handbook.fca.org.uk

Please let us know how you would like to proceed? 

Yours sincerely 

JQ

Is that true? I would say from first hand experience that it is a lie.

Cash_Waster

poppasmurf_2 said:

Both of those are now settled. Hurrah. That was with Cabot.

Now I have a problem with Pra Group requested my CCA .... I received a reconstituted CCA but no signed agreement. They sent a letter to say it is unenforceable. But still to pay. 

I said no. 

This is the reply

"Hi C

Thank you for your response. 

Agreements provided do not have to be the original documents, a reconstituted agreement is deemed as being acceptable to our regulators and does not have to contain signatures or be the actual signed agreement. You can get further info on the CCA website around acceptable reconstituted agreements www.handbook.fca.org.uk

Please let us know how you would like to proceed? 

Yours sincerely 

JQ

Is that true? I would say from first hand experience that it is a lie.

Is it barclaycard by any chance with PRA?

they keep sending me the same stuff from barclaycard. 

Its a “reconstituted agreement 

the only thing on it is my name and address. The wording is the same as my wife received snd we took out the card 18 months between. 

No sign of any apr or date to say when the terms where updated etc. 

they are doing my head in. I have offered 30% to them. They have offered me 80%. 

1 is definitely enforceable 
1 is not so far and
1 is barclaycard which i dispute is enforcable

poppasmurf_2

Cash_Waster said:

poppasmurf_2 said:

Both of those are now settled. Hurrah. That was with Cabot.

Now I have a problem with Pra Group requested my CCA .... I received a reconstituted CCA but no signed agreement. They sent a letter to say it is unenforceable. But still to pay. 

I said no. 

This is the reply

"Hi C

Thank you for your response. 

Agreements provided do not have to be the original documents, a reconstituted agreement is deemed as being acceptable to our regulators and does not have to contain signatures or be the actual signed agreement. You can get further info on the CCA website around acceptable reconstituted agreements www.handbook.fca.org.uk

Please let us know how you would like to proceed? 

Yours sincerely 

JQ

Is that true? I would say from first hand experience that it is a lie.

Is it barclaycard by any chance with PRA?

they keep sending me the same stuff from barclaycard. 

Its a “reconstituted agreement 

the only thing on it is my name and address. The wording is the same as my wife received snd we took out the card 18 months between. 

No sign of any apr or date to say when the terms where updated etc. 

they are doing my head in. I have offered 30% to them. They have offered me 80%. 

1 is definitely enforceable 
1 is not so far and
1 is barclaycard which i dispute is enforca

Nope, Halifax. Same stuff you got. I could have made it on my computer added anyones name and say you owe that. I should send them one. Haha They are a very odd DCA.
Can't be a legal document without a signature?

I'm not paying anymore to them. Unless they can add a default to my credit score, which the last page says they can do... Is that true?

fatbelly

It's true that a s77-79 request can be complied with by sending a reconstituted agreement.

The rules are set out here

https://www.handbook.fca.org.uk/handbook/CONC/13/?view=chapter

You said that they had sent a letter saying the debt was unenforceable. Presumably that was before they sent the reconstituted agreement. Their latest letter seems to indicate that they consider the debt to be enforceable.

If you want to challenge this, then you invite them to start a court claim, which you will defend. You would probably need specialist help to do that.

As for adding a default to your credit report, that appears to be a standard phrase in a standard letter. For PRA to have bought the debt it must have been defaulted by the original lender. That date stays as the date of default and any entry, either from the original lender or PRA, must drop off 6 years from that date.

Only a ccj would create a fresh entry (in a different section)

poppasmurf_2

fatbelly said:

It's true that a s77-79 request can be complied with by sending a reconstituted agreement.

The rules are set out here

https://www.handbook.fca.org.uk/handbook/CONC/13/?view=chapter

You said that they had sent a letter saying the debt was unenforceable. Presumably that was before they sent the reconstituted agreement. Their latest letter seems to indicate that they consider the debt to be enforceable.

If you want to challenge this, then you invite them to start a court claim, which you will defend. You would probably need specialist help to do that.

As for adding a default to your credit report, that appears to be a standard phrase in a standard letter. For PRA to have bought the debt it must have been defaulted by the original lender. That date stays as the date of default and any entry, either from the original lender or PRA, must drop off 6 years from that date.

Only a ccj would create a fresh entry (in a different section)

Nope, the item reconstituted agreement was included with the letter.

In Email they say it's enforcable.

I think they have made a huge error.

Thanks for the reply, so continue to pay the £1 then, it's an old debt it's not on my credit report. I am clearing up older debts with f&f settlements.

Also thank you and one last question I can add it to any any payment plan like an IVA DMP DRO?

fatbelly

I was confused as you said earlier 'They sent a letter to say it is unenforceable.'

Just because they say it is now enforceable does not mean it is. There could be many reasons for unenforceability including an inadequate response to a s77/79 request.

They have six years to get the court to test this from the date you stopped paying but that would require them to stump up money to start the claim and put the effort in to prove their case. They may not want to do this on an old, small debt.

If you are going to try f&f then you may as well stick to your position that you don't believe this is enforceable but you are able to make a small offer to bring the matter to an end.

I wouldn't recommend doing full & finals ahead of any insolvency action as you can be found to have treated them preferentially

jack290292

Can anyone help with some advice where to go from here please?

I have a DMP through Stepchange and with the help of a gifted sum from family members I was hoping a full and final partial settlement could be agreed.

Stepchange have proposed the offers, all around 42% of the remaining debt - so far these are the responses:

Tesco Bank - 2 debts - decision still being considered

Moorcroft - 2 debts - 1 agreed the 2nd propsed 65.14%

Co-operative Bank - 2 debts awaiting decision

Intrum UK - 3 debts - All no's with counter offer of 95% (Really how do they think I can pay that %)

I was in a well paid job until early this year, I then had a breakdown and had to leave my job. I'm now working part-time on "Bank" hours so as and when available. With household bills increasing, petrol sky high and the fact that I am 62 this year so the chances of me getting back into full-time, well paid employment are very slim. This was all explained in the offer letter.

What is my best option once I've had all the responses back? Just pay the one that says yes and then continue until retirement to pay a minimal amount to the remaining creditors?

I really thought 42% was a good offer in the current climate - any practical advice would be gratefully received.

Thanks

RAS

Do check that these debts have actually been defaulted? And not marked arrangement to pay or similar.

You've been paying regularly, so they are taking a punt that will continue.

jack290292

RAS said:

Do check that these debts have actually been defaulted? And not marked arrangement to pay or similar.

You've been paying regularly, so they are taking a punt that will continue.

Mmm thanks - Intrum UK have for sure, defaulted and therefore passed from Creation Finance to the agency. Same with the Moorcroft debts.

Not sure with Tesco & Coop....

They've had an explanation why payments can't continue, well they can, but they will be so small they will still be paid for about the next 10 years so well after I retire!

Getting_there_slowly

Just thought I'd share todays update and ask an opinion. I tried to negotiate with my three companies (covering four debts). I didn't really want to jump to CCA because part of me felt guilt because it was my debt after all. However, while one company did at least get in touch, their offer wasn't much of an offer at all, one company outright refused anything less than 100% for two of the debts and the remaining company never even replied!

So...... I sent off CCA letters.

The no-negotiation company just wrote back saying they haven't got them and both debts are unenforceable. And one company wrote back and said that they have "requested the information". Curiously they don't actually say it's unenforceable in the letter, but the little "what does this all mean" leaflet included with the letter says that, after the 12 days has elapsed, it is unenforceable. So I guess it's unenforceable? That's three out of four. And they were all from mid 2000s so I wouldn't be surprised if the final one is the same.

At what point do I tell my DMP to stop paying them? I've read in places that it maybe best to continue to pay for the next few months in case something comes up, but I'm not sure if that's under different circumstances to mine. Should I give them a few months to see if their request from the original people comes up with something? Or do I accept that it's unenforceable now, stop paying, and resume if something turns up later?

Oh, and my credit file wouldn't be a problem. These defaulted about 10 years ago so they're long gone 

Thank you.