Bank Charges - illegal?

Turning_into_scrooge

dchurch24 wrote:

Don't forget, that's 8% APR, not just an 8% added on top.

Sorry to sound stupid but what is the difference and how do you work out 8%APR?

carled

Just a quickie... I argued with my bank (First Direct) over "over limit" charges (some of which were £75+ for being £30 over for a day or two). They eventually agreed to pay back almost all charges. However, in that same month, they charged me about £100 more for a couple of tiny, and I mean TINY transgressions. When I wrote asking them what the heck they were playing at, I got a senior credit adviser writing back saying words to the effect of, "we played ball and gave you a bit of a refund. You now have a choice, we'll refund your money and you have to shut down all your accounts with us and pay back any outstanding loans (my wife has one from ages ago that she can in no way afford to pay back) or you can keep quiet and lump it."

Is this an unfair angle of argument from the bank and should I pursue this further or not?

fairylights_2

I know, there are lots of posts already about this, but ... I've checked OH's current account and he's had less than £100 in charges in the last four years. I know my current ac (Barclays) was bad until this time last year when I managed to get it all in order, but don't have statements detailing exactly how much my charges were in the years preceding. OH's Mastercard appears (from the records we have) to have charged him at least £20 every month due to one charge or another - which is especially cheeky since they never sent a letter, they just put the charge on his statement.

If I'm going to write to ask for the charges back, do I need to know exactly how much I'm asking for? How do I find out if we no longer have the statements? Can I just copy the generic letter and keep my fingers crossed? Oh, and since his account and card are both with Lloyds, do we include both within the same letter to Lloyds head office, or one to card services and one to h/o?

Thanks in advance, guys!

gothicf0rm

your loans should have nothing to do with your current account carled and are on a separate contract. they can't call them in unless youre not paying them, i assume you are. youll find on the loans contract the conditions they can call them in on, eg you dont pay for two months. if this is the case they are arguably breaking the law however by threatening to do so, its illegal to threaten a debtor with action the claimant cannot take or action that is unlawful. if i were you i'd move to another bank and then take them to court over the fee citing that they also harassed you as a debtor, dont worry about the loans. you might want to complain to your local trading standards office too.

fairylights, dont write to them yet. get ALL your statements first from them for the last six years by requesting them under the data protection act then add up all the charges, remember to request all their interest rate changes too - people forget this but its a useful way to get extra money they screwed out of you.
with a credit card its vital you take into account their interest rate too as theyve charged you interest on each charge that can be substantial, much more so than a current account. at £20 charge with 25% apr on it works out at £25 in total... if they charged you years ago you could be looking at the charges being double what they first appear. once youve calculated these then add 8% apr interest on top thanks to the county court act and then demand this money back with the generic letter. its vital you know precisely how much money to demand to the last penny before you write to them so you appear in control of the situation.

dchurch24

Turning_into_scrooge wrote:

Sorry to sound stupid but what is the difference and how do you work out 8%APR?

It's 0.00022% per day, each day until the court date.

gothicf0rm

but thats 8.03% per year.

dchurch24

It doesn't pan exactly, but then if the bank query it then they are more-or-less admitting that they are going to pay up!!

westernpromise

Has anyone tried charging banks interest on their own unauthorised overdraft interest rate of 25% or whatever, rather than at 8%?

dchurch24

The 1984 County Courts Act will only allow 8% APR. Up until 1984 it used to be 16%.

However, you should be able to claim back the interest over the top of their authorised rate, as the unlawfull charges forced the unauthorised rate in the first place.

studentindebt

This is an amazing topic!!

have just sent the following to Nationwide via internet banking.

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30/01/06


WITHOUT PREDJUDICE

Dear Sir,

ACCOUNT NUMBER: xxxxxxxx

I have held the above mentioned current account with Nationwide for the past year and before this I have been a customer of Nationwide since I had a childrens smart account. During this time I have incurred charges for exceeding my overdraft limit due to cheques being cleared at unfortunate times, unauthorized overdraft fees, direct debits and standing orders being dishonored (and in some cases honored) due to insufficient funds. These charges meant you were penalizing me during periods of financial difficulty.

It is my opinion, and that of the Office of Fair Trading (OFT), that these charges are punitive in nature, not a genuine pre-estimate of cost and not intended to re-imburse your losses for a breach of contract occurring. Further to the 1999 Consumer Credit Regulations quoted by the OFT, there are numerous cases in law that prove that punitive charges in contracts are unenforceable at English law.

Murray v Leasureplay (2004)
Dunlop Tyre Company v New Garage and Motor Co. (1915)
Bridge v. Campbell Discount Co. Ltd. (1962)

There are many more cases of this type – far more than I have room to list here.

Further to these cases, I also believe these charges to be a direct breach of the 1977 Unfair Terms (contracts) Act which require that contract terms be reasonable. I do not believe these charges are reasonable as outlined in the aforementioned act.


With this in mind, I respectfully request that you return to me ALL charges made on this account in the last 6 years within 7 days of receipt of this letter - 06/02/06 - by way of immediate payment to the above account or personal cheque. This amount is £577. If you choose not to do so, I will start proceedings for recovery in the County Courts, as I believe that legally I am entitled to this money back. By doing so, you will be eligible for my court costs and for an extra 8% APR as allowed by the County Courts Act (1984). This money would be used in some way to clear my overdraft on this account.

Further to this, if you decide NOT to accept my offer of settlement of this issue, I would like to make a formal request under the Data Protection Act (1998) for a complete and exhaustive list of all charges made on this account over the last 6 years. As you are no doubt aware, you are afforded 40 days to comply with this request or you must request an extension from the Information Commissioner. If you are of any doubt that this information is covered by the act, may I respectfully draw your attention to the case of Durant v LloydsTSB where the judge ruled that bank statement information is indeed personal information and thus covered. In any event, this information is requested with a view to prospective legal action on my part and therefore would be covered under the same act.

Yours faithfully,

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Any idea what thy might say/do? Im worried now!!!