Puppy Advice (merged)

Jellicat

I dont think anyone implied the boxer was deliberately bred like that...the whole programme was about how small the gene pool was getting in these dogs. This is whats causing these illnesses. In ALL breeds. There is no breed that comes without its health problems, just some that have far healthier tendency than dogs like boxers, newfies, pugs and bulldogs. You only have to look at the extreme look of dogs like these and pekes, bassetts and so on to see what we are doing to them. We always had springer spaniels and only one ever lived past ten. We now have a cross (he's still a spaniel, but a springerXcocker) and he is proving to outlive them all. Not the most scientific view, but it speaks volumes. No doubt it has a lot to do with the popularity of these breeds too, especially with labradors. And golden retrievers, who are absolutely delightful dogs, are just suffering with everything because of the amount of over breeding that goes on.

toshkininny

when I do eventually get a new family pet, after all these comments I have actually decided I will get a cross breed.

foreign_correspondent

toshkininny wrote: »

I have decided now to wait a few more years until we get a new dog - just to let you know. I want the children to be a little older and learn how to be a responsible dog owner.

The reason why we have decided to leave it a while is that we are looking after someone's 6 month old puppy/dog while they are on holiday and she is being a typical puppy - something that I have forgotten about. She is biting, chewing, grabbing everything. She has chewed he laptop adapter, and eaten (without going into too much detail) a used nappy, (don't ask!), amongst other things! An adorable, beautiful dog, but I am constantly having to pick up the toys so that they are not ruined!

Thank you for all your help, though, and I will certainly look into those websites suggested.

What a super post:T - I think you will make a great dog owner when you do decide to become one as you will be going into it with your eyes open and a realistic expectation.

So many people post on here that they want a puppy, and there have been a few that re-appear a couple of weeks later, having very quickly bought one, and are then dumbfounded when they start chewing, destroying and weeing! Sometimes they are so unprepared for this that the pup is likely to end up unwanted very shortly. :mad:

As you say, all this is "normal puppy behavior" and all very much par for the course!!! - And it really is not fair to get a puppy unless you can happily deal with all this, in addition to the toilet training, daily walks, vet fees and everything else that owning a dog implies.

If you do not want to deal with all the hard work and mess of the puppy stage (and to be honest, who would!! lol) then an older rescue dog with a proven temprement and basic training would be a better choice!

Best wishes,

fc

MRSCARNEY

smileypigface wrote: »

Are you looking for a particular breed as there are some good web sites that are breed specific that are very helpful - for example we have a springer spaniel and find www.itsaspringthing.co.uk a really useful point for reference, recommendations and help from other owners.

.

That looks a great website - can't wait to look through it in more detail. I have 2 Springers lying next to me on the settee right now

To the OP, you should expect to be asked lots of questions by whoever you get a dog/pup off (if they are responsible) and not be offended by it. When we were finding homes for our pups each potential new owner was "grilled" for at least an hour. We needed to know that people had thought through all the pro's and con's of owning a dog. In return they got to spend time with the pups and their mum and could see that they were all fit and well.

Now we get photo's of the dogs happy in their new homes and it's great to see.:j

RooBee

toshkininny wrote: »

when I do eventually get a new family pet, after all these comments I have actually decided I will get a cross breed.

Be aware that crossbreeds and mongrels can suffer from any/all of the inherited disorders present in the breeds which which make it up.

True mongrels 'can' be less likely to be affected (although not guaranteed) but would need to come from several generations of mongrel bred to mongrel. Since you'll probably only ever get a mongrel from a shelter, you won't know it's history to know how many generations and what breeds have gone before.

Deliberate crossbreeding will bring through the hereditary disorders to some extent but you are increasing the number of potential disorders by putting two different breeds together.

Take the popular Labradoodle for example...both Labdradors and Poodles are known to suffer from Hip Dysplasia and the same genetic eye disorder. How, therefore, would putting these 2 breeds together give you a helathier breed? Of course, good breeders will do all the relevant health tests and only breed from the healthiest animals. You'll easily find a breeder of Poodles or Labradors that breed ethically and responsibly...I can guarantee you'll have to go a long way to find a Labradoodle breeder who carries out ALL the relevant test for both breeds.

Also, putting 2 breeds together wo have different construction will cause joint problems. I have first hand experience of this in the crossbreed that I took in as a rehome (it was an accidental litter). He is a combination of two very different breeds whose back legs have completely different construction. The result is a 4 year old dog that has undergone 2 major surgeries (about £4k and counting in vet fees) and has had severe arthritis from the age of 2. A brilliant example of how much healthier crossbreeds are, eh?

Incidently, I also have a pedigree breed that someone above wrote off as desperately unhealthy...I can tell you that she is 3 and a half years old and a picture of health...no sign of any of the hereditary conditions that can affect the breed...most of which would have been evident by 18 months of they were going to be a problem.

The difference is, I take on a dog of the pedigree breed knowing what to look for in a breeder, what the potential problems will be and how to minimise the chances of any problems arising. Forewarned is forearmed. On the other hand, I cannot describe the feeling of standing looking at an x-ray and hearing the vet tell you that your 2 year old dog has crippling arthritis and will likely have pain every day for the rest of his life. Luckily, we have a fantastic vet who is an orthopaedic specialist and, with careful management, my dog is doing better than anyone could have anticipated at the time of diagnosis. How long this will continue is anyone's guess....

Then you've got the added complication that you never know what you're going to get with a crossbreed in terms of temperament. Breeders of deliberate crossbreeds will tell you that you only get the best of both breeds. If only genetics worked like that! Every pup in a litter inherits 50% of its genes from its mother and 50% from its father but not every pup will get he same combination in equal measure. So every pup in the litter will be slighlty different in terms of looks and temperament. You pay your money (and it's a considerable wad of cash in many cases) and you take your chance as no-one will be able to predict what the adult dog will be like. If this is the route you want to go down, then you may as well adopt a dog from a shelter.

The BBC programme featured about half a dozen breeds and half a dozen breeders of pedigree dogs, all selected for maximum shock factor. There are currently 208 breeds of dog recognised by the UK Kennel Club...the vast majority of which didn't get a mention on that programme. Why? There is nothing shocking to report, that's why. The Backyard Breeders and 'just one litter' brigade are doing more harm to pedigree breeds than caring breeders will ever do.

As long as you do your research into the breeder and the breed, there is absolutely no reason that you won't find a healthy dog to join your family when the time is right.

toshkininny

that's an interesting post, thanks.

pink_piggy17

There's nothing wrong with adopting a "mongrel" but definitely steer clear of any "breeders" who are breeding designer crossbred dogs on purpose (e.g. labradoodles, maltipoos etc!)

also, there isn't really any reason to put off getting a dog unless you are working long hours etc. I know my 2 dogs take very little looking after, give them a drink and snack in the morning, walk for an hour or so in the afternoon and their meal in the evening. all they want really is your company and to have some fun (ours come out in the car if we go somewhere usually as they looove the car) and of course as much playing out in the garden or around the house as possible and a bit of training. But of course it's your personal preference, but I'm just saying, as some people seem to be under the impression that taking care of a dog is a mammoth task lol. (a puppy however is quite hard work until they get older though admittedly but is just as much fun as well!)

MissKate1986

RooBee wrote: »

Be aware that crossbreeds and mongrels can suffer from any/all of the inherited disorders present in the breeds which which make it up.

True mongrels 'can' be less likely to be affected (although not guaranteed) but would need to come from several generations of mongrel bred to mongrel. Since you'll probably only ever get a mongrel from a shelter, you won't know it's history to know how many generations and what breeds have gone before.

Deliberate crossbreeding will bring through the hereditary disorders to some extent but you are increasing the number of potential disorders by putting two different breeds together.

Take the popular Labradoodle for example...both Labdradors and Poodles are known to suffer from Hip Dysplasia and the same genetic eye disorder. How, therefore, would putting these 2 breeds together give you a helathier breed? Of course, good breeders will do all the relevant health tests and only breed from the healthiest animals. You'll easily find a breeder of Poodles or Labradors that breed ethically and responsibly...I can guarantee you'll have to go a long way to find a Labradoodle breeder who carries out ALL the relevant test for both breeds.

Also, putting 2 breeds together wo have different construction will cause joint problems. I have first hand experience of this in the crossbreed that I took in as a rehome (it was an accidental litter). He is a combination of two very different breeds whose back legs have completely different construction. The result is a 4 year old dog that has undergone 2 major surgeries (about £4k and counting in vet fees) and has had severe arthritis from the age of 2. A brilliant example of how much healthier crossbreeds are, eh?

Incidently, I also have a pedigree breed that someone above wrote off as desperately unhealthy...I can tell you that she is 3 and a half years old and a picture of health...no sign of any of the hereditary conditions that can affect the breed...most of which would have been evident by 18 months of they were going to be a problem.

The difference is, I take on a dog of the pedigree breed knowing what to look for in a breeder, what the potential problems will be and how to minimise the chances of any problems arising. Forewarned is forearmed. On the other hand, I cannot describe the feeling of standing looking at an x-ray and hearing the vet tell you that your 2 year old dog has crippling arthritis and will likely have pain every day for the rest of his life. Luckily, we have a fantastic vet who is an orthopaedic specialist and, with careful management, my dog is doing better than anyone could have anticipated at the time of diagnosis. How long this will continue is anyone's guess....

Then you've got the added complication that you never know what you're going to get with a crossbreed in terms of temperament. Breeders of deliberate crossbreeds will tell you that you only get the best of both breeds. If only genetics worked like that! Every pup in a litter inherits 50% of its genes from its mother and 50% from its father but not every pup will get he same combination in equal measure. So every pup in the litter will be slighlty different in terms of looks and temperament. You pay your money (and it's a considerable wad of cash in many cases) and you take your chance as no-one will be able to predict what the adult dog will be like. If this is the route you want to go down, then you may as well adopt a dog from a shelter.

The BBC programme featured about half a dozen breeds and half a dozen breeders of pedigree dogs, all selected for maximum shock factor. There are currently 208 breeds of dog recognised by the UK Kennel Club...the vast majority of which didn't get a mention on that programme. Why? There is nothing shocking to report, that's why. The Backyard Breeders and 'just one litter' brigade are doing more harm to pedigree breeds than caring breeders will ever do.

As long as you do your research into the breeder and the breed, there is absolutely no reason that you won't find a healthy dog to join your family when the time is right.

I could not agree more about the Labradoodles I nearly posted exactly the same thing. Good for you for bringing it to peoples attention perhaps now people will see thats its not such a good thing. Excellent post!!

LucyLoo2_3

Would just like to add, mongrels do not come without health problems too, especially as the majority are 'accidents' I got my current dog as a 12 week old puppy she's a collie x lab x german shepard, she was advertised as free to good home, but as few of the litter had been taken the owner decided to hand them over to the dogs home (which is a fate worse than death with manchester dogs home!). I had been looking for a dog for ages and having experience with collies I decided I would like to have one, I met the owner through my work, and have since met 2 other people who took on pups from the same litter. She is 2 in October and the 2 others that I am aware of have since been put to sleep, one for attacking a child, the other after suffering fits was diagnosed with a brain tumour. Mine is a very nervous dog and is literally scared of everything! She loves people, but is terrified of inanimate objects usually (wheelie bins, umbellas, kids toys in gardens, cars, double decker buses, prams, shopping trolleys... need I go on!) I have and still am having to work so hard with her!

I have since found out that the owners had a GS x and a collie x, which accidentally (obvious really if you don't take precautions!) had a litter of which they kept a male and a female, none of which were neutered, the young female had a litter at one and it could have been her, brother or her father that got her pregnant they don't know, the rest of the litter ended up in rescue, total irresponsible ownership, and I know that a few unscrupulous pedigree breeders have done the same! I have heard that the 'mum' has since had another litter possibly fathered by the brother, all of which have landed in rescue!

I love my little dog sooo much and wouldn't change her for the best pedigree in the world, but I do worry about future health problems terribly as well as the constant battle with her behaviour, I suppose what I am trying to say is that you never know what your getting, pedigree or not unless you fully research the breeder, go on recommendations etc. Which is what worries me so much with rescue pups but every dog deserves a chance, god only knows what would have happened to my dog if she had ended up in different hands!

Jellicat

I guess the moral of the story for everyone here is...pedigree or mongrel, INSURE THAT DOG!