Father_in_law going into care home 117 funded

stevew48

Hi,

My father-in-law (77) is going into a residential EMI care home as he has vascular dementia. He was sectioned both under 2 & 3 on the mental health act and we have been told that he will receive full funding under 117 aftercare. My mother-in-law (73) still lives in the family home which they own and is worth about £140K. Her will leaves everything to him and if he dies first then to their only daughter. His will is the opposite. Since he will never leave the care home should my mother-in-law change her will to discretionary trust or should they become tennants in common in case my mother-in-law dies before my father-in-law. My wife, their only daughter, has an EPA on both signed but not actioned.

Thanks for any advice

localhero

Hi stevew48,

If your mother in law dies whilst your father in law is still in the care home, then he will be means tested on any amount he inherits for care fees.

Therefore your mother in law would be wise to sever the joint tenancy and make a new Will.

Legally, the other co-owner should be notified of the intention to sever the joint tenancy, but where he lacks capacity, then his attorneys.

It is fortunate that there is a Power of Attorney in place, so a potential problem can be avoided.

McKneff

just wanted to confirm what local hero has said.

my husband and i did go down the tennants in common and trust route 2 years ago while in our mid fifties
just to avoid what steve's potential problem dont know why everybody who owns property doesnt do it.

sorry about your dad. best wishes to you

EdInvestor

stevew48 wrote: »

Hi,

My father-in-law (77) is going into a residential EMI care home as he has vascular dementia. He was sectioned both under 2 & 3 on the mental health act and we have been told that he will receive full funding under 117 aftercare.

AFAIK the FIL will be legally entitled to fully-funded NHS care as he has been sectioned and thus the authorities will not be looking at him or his family paying any of the cost.

Suggest you consult your solicitor about the best way foward.

stevew48

Hi all

Thanks for the advice. EdInvestor I thought that my FIL would not have to pay as he is 117 funded though I do know that some local authorities have tried to remove patients from 117 in the past. Is my FIL still entitled to keep his basic state pension at the mo my MIL collects it and puts it into his account.

stevew

soolin

EdInvestor wrote: »

AFAIK the FIL will be legally entitled to fully-funded NHS care as he has been sectioned and thus the authorities will not be looking at him or his family paying any of the cost.

Suggest you consult your solicitor about the best way foward.

I'm interested in this. My Dad has vascular dementia and is in a specialist home and yet is fully self funded..apart from his basic pension and attendance allowance he gets to assistance at all. He is not however sectioned although he did spend a couple of months in a pyschiatric hospital for assessment .

Is it worth approaching a solicitor to see if there is any way the state can be persuaded to contribute towards dad's care?

JohnnieW

Soolin, if your father has vascular dementia and in a nursing home it is virtually certain that he should be fully funded by the NHS for continuing care. If he is a nursing home, it suggests that he needs more than residential care. (the clue is in the name!)
However, it is notoriously difficult to get NHS continuing care, even though there are court cases upon court cases giving definitions.
Nevertheless, you should not be put off by trying to claim. I would advise specialist help however.
It is also possible for the awards to be backdated, so if he has been paying for some years when he should not be, it is possible to reclaim. It is even possible to make a claim when someone has died.
How long has he been in nursing care (if it is a nursing home) and how much does he pay?
You should be aware that if he receives NHS continuing care, his AA will be stopped as it is regarded as a stay in a NHS hospital.
You should without a shadow aof a doubt claim!
Good luck.

Fin1_2

Soolin,
If your Dad has already been placed in a care home his needs and finances will have already been assessed. He would be deemed to be self funding if he has over £22, 000 in assets. If his savings fall below this amount you need to contact the local Social Services and they will reassess him and take over the fee if required. One small note of caution would be that some care homes do not accept social services rates and may then require a 'top up' from the family to make the fee up to what it originally was. If this is not forthcoming they may ask you to find another home that does accept social services fees.

As he is self funding he has not been assessed as requiring Continuing Health Care (CHC) - this is for people with very high health needs due to their condition and the fee is paid for by the Primary Healthcare Trust (although his condition could obviously change). Another note of caution would be that some local authorities only place people assessed as needing CHC in certain homes and therefore he may have to move.

Hope this helps

margaretclare

anniehanlon wrote: »

my husband and i did go down the tenants in common and trust route 2 years ago while in our mid fifties
just to avoid what steve's potential problem don't know why everybody who owns property doesn't do it.

Given that everyone's circumstances are different, there may be good and valid reasons why 'everybody' does not.

Some of us have thought it through and have made different arrangements.

JohnnieW

Fin1, you are right about the Social Services being involved if assets drop below a certain level, but this is NHS continuing care, and it is the health authority who pay.
It is extremely unlikely that the NHS will force him to move out of accommodation in which he was settled, as it could be argued to be detrimental to his health.
In response to the question from the OP, if the NHS are paying for the cost of care, then this is not means tested, and it would make no difference to the estate. This seems to be the likely position AFAICS.
However, if he is self funding, then leaving him money from the will, would be unwise, as social services do means test.

Fin1_2

JohnnieW
Soolin's dad is in a care home with nursing which does get paid for by either social services or individuals (including £101 Registered nursing care contribution) Just because he needs nursing does not mean that he is being funded by continuing health care. Sad to say, I work within an authority where clients with dementia who are assessed as needing CHC are moved.