Need advice about nasty neighbours

hollydays

How has it got to the point that you have received a letter from them.
What about any dialogue before this?
You don't mention what conversations have gone on before this....which seems very odd.
How did they get to the point of being "bullying"?

oldMcDonald

bubblesmoney wrote: »

<snip>
do these things only if u have the will and the means to carry it through to its logical conclusion and to tolerate the hiccups and aggravations along the way, otherwise dont go down the legal confrontation path and be resigned to getting harassed or giving in to their harassment. best of luck

(snipped quote to save thread space, but agree with every word!)

I have had a b*gger of a NFH in a past property, and just wanted to repeat the above as it is a very important thought to consider.

Fantastic post, bubblesmoney :T

olly300

FenceGirl wrote: »

The path is in the back garden & runs the full length along the westerly edge of our plot. In every garden in this terrace is a path like this, so our nasty neighbors have their own path. We are not trying to stop them from using the only access to the end of the garden. They have their own path. These paths are an old fashioned hangover from when no one had fences between the gardens, as is normal nowadays, & used there gardens more like a small holding plot. To quote the technical term, they are not appropriate to a modern setting. And yes, the solicitor has done the above letter.

Doesn't matter there is nothing stopping you removing the path, landscaping your garden and putting the fence up on your land. Any repeated attempts to stop you due to their being large dogs around or to destroy/tamper with your property could be seen as harassment by any reasonable person.

I strongly doubt your neighbour knows the law inside out and if you do what bubblesmoney says going down the harassment route rather than the boundary dispute/access route, your neighbour will be in for a shock as they will have no defence.

BTW your defence for changing your garden around is to stop the harassment. Likewise your defence for putting up the fence is to stop the large dogs from entering your property.

ruggedtoast

You can be firm with people without getting angry. The OP has a right to assert her own legal boundary and I doubt that giving in and letting the neighbours have the path will be the end of the trouble, they'll just find something else to aggravate her about.

IMO however a letter from the solicitor isnt the best way forward. I would invite the neighbours round (or offer to go round to theirs) , explain to them you are building the fence and why. Strange as it may sound a lot of people who act like complete tools think they re doing so in a kind of self defence, if you explain how upsetting their behaviour is and you want the fence predominantly to keep them out it may make them look at themselves a bit.

I admit this would be harder than communicating via solicitor but its also going to be a lot cheaper and give you a better chance of cohabiting with your neighbours.

This isnt the Manson family after all, just childish adults who cant get along with people.

bubblesmoney

i dont think one can negotiate with a bully as to why they cant have access to YOUR property.

the only ways to deal with a bully as far as i can understand are

• collect evidence on the harassment and file a criminal case for harassment under the 'protection from harassment act and also ask for police intervention after supplying them with the collected evidence. if u complain without 'irrefutable evidence' i guess the police wont bother, they dont have the staff or the time for 'small things' like this anymore. they are all busy filling in paperwork or trying to hit the useless targets that the jerks in labour govt have started for all public services. so their energies are diverted to saving their own backsides or filling in useless forms most of the time. only if u supply 'irrefutable' evidence yourself can u hope of the police doing anything about it and to pass the file onto CPS for prosecution. and that is a big if i think. so ur best bet is collecting evidence yourself and finding no win no fee lawyers for a case. if u have good enough evidence then the no win no fee lawyers i feel will be definitely interested as they can recover the costs from the other party if they own their house, then costs can be recovered from their proeprty if they dont have funds. and when u file a case be sure to include ONLY THE POINTS THAT U CAN PROVE BEYOND DOUBT. otherwise if u win on some points and the other party wins some points then both parties might end up sharing the cost. SO IT IS VITAL U RAISE POINTS THAT CAN BE PROVED BEYOND DOUBT to reduce ur chances of being stuck with legal bills. so go after getting atleast a criminal conviction that way you can count on getting some compensation under 'protection from harassment act' which has got both civil and criminal penalties. in employment disputes the same act has been used for huge damages. it was originally used against stalking case but later in employment disputes. so no reason why the same law cannot be enforced in harassment cases from neighbours
• sell up and move out, if u cant handle their antics and dont want to confront them
• try talking to them (i would not do that) only if u must (cos u r loathe to use the other options) but i bet it wont improve things. bullies wont be bullies if they had a brain in the first place to reason out how to be courteous and kind to others. what ever u do, if u consider talking to ur neighbour as some here have suggested. DO NOT INVITE THEM INTO UR OWN HOME OR IN ANY PLACE WHERE U R ALONE WITH THEM. ALWAYS MEET IN A PUBLIC PLACE WHERE THERE WILL BE WITNESSES (PLUS USE A VOICE ACTIVATED DICTAPHONE DISCRETELY) and someone around to intervene if the bully gets out of hand. do dont place urself in a situation where things can rapidly go wrong and u r alone. u r only inviting trouble by doing that
• dont do anything and sit out the troubles and hope for things to improve and be prepared to face the music if things get worse

i know which option i would choose. collect evidence and use that against them in a legal case and hit them (in a criminal case even if it meant me losing money) hard, so that when they get a criminal conviction they will get their knickers in a twist for a long long time to come and wont know how or what hit them. getting some compensatory damages would be a bonus, but i wouldnt bank on that.

any route u choose brings headaches and worries. there is no denying that. but i feel the only thing that happens by following the 'hugging the hoodie-david cameron' line is that u get stabbed or whacked on ur head by the hoodie.

but sometimes one has no options other than keeping quiet and moving on for the sake of ur sanity or for the sake of ur dependants. thats life.

ps: did anyone notice that the same cameron who wanted to 'hug the hoodies' scheme launched when other people were facing the music, when he had his bike stolen in the last couple of days is now asking for sharia law for the bike thief. whats good for the goose is not good for the gander i bet when a politicians purse is on the line i guess

zebulon

FenceGirl wrote: »

No one should let themselves be bullied. The truth will prevail!

GO GIRL !!! :beer: :j :T :dance:

MrsE_2

Incisor wrote: »

Don't scatter pearls before swine. I don't know what the answer is but I would say that people of this ilk would not appreciate it in any sense other than as an indicator that their bullying behaviour is being rewarded.

I agree, I wouldn't do anything for them.

redcar_2

You only need to get into the legal battle if you want to and if there is a continuing problem once you put up your fence. If you put up the fence can you see what happens then. You don't need to win any legal battle to put up this fence.

You are supposing that there is still going to be a problem even though your solicitor has told you and them the position. Have they responded to you about the solicitor's letter. Why do they think they have a right to use the path? Have they said anything specific?

One last thing - how long have they been using the path? Did they move in before or after you? You can establish a right of way if you have used it for so many years as posted above.

FenceGirl

Thanks to everyone for the supportive comments & advice. My neighbors are horrible. They are impossible to talk to. The man either gets blinding drunk whilst you try to talk to him or swears so much it doesn't make grammatical sense. We have lived here for 5 years trying to be tactful & diplomatic with these people, but they still think they can do what they like! They are bullies, & not very bright ones at that. We know legally no one can stop you fencing your boundary. And it doesn't say in the deeds that fences must not be erected. When we first saw our solicitor he couldn't see what our problem was, but now he has got to know the charactors involved he understands that we just need to assert ourselves with him as a legal hammer. I have asked for him to arrange a meeting between us & them with all solicitors present. We will state our case, but also draw attention to the harrassment side. We know their solicitor will have no idea about that side. Hopefully he will advise them to pack it in & let us get on with our fence because a harrassment case could cost them alot more then the fence issue on it's own. We have neighbors witness statements & photos, including the dog bite wound when their german shepard bit me (This was not reported at the time as we needed a party wall agreement signed to get our roof repaired. If we had got the Police involved & the dog destroyed, they would never have signed the agreement...Rock & hard place I know!!)
It is tough, but at the end of the day I love my house & garden. I'm not moving! I want my family to enjoy their garden in peace & safety. I don't want to ever try & be friends with these people. 6ft high larch lap is all I want. This situation has made my husband ill, but strangley getting things moving with solicitors is helping him. Sitting & putting up with them is not an option. We are not prepared to take it anymore. I will repost as soon as we have an outcome. Thanks again for the support.

bubblesmoney

since it is affecting yours and ur hubbys health (stress, bite wound etc) involve your GP with this. mention about neighbour dispute causing the stress etc and if u got the bite wound treated then get copies of the paperwork regarding that episode. when such harassment affects ur health or ur partners health it is important to have evidence regarding the same. just saying it affected ur health wont do much good, medical evidence will hold much more water if it comes to a harassment case and also the amount of dmages awarded etc i think. so keep on collecting evidence in what ever way u can and if u r forced to go to court, make sure u nail them for good. remember court cases are a lot about evidence and not what u feel. so gather as much evidence as you can. best of luck