To service or NOT to service

lisyloo

Would appreciate advice on this.

My car is H reg 1990 and has done 136K miles.
It's virtually worthless but is very reliable (hasn't broken down in 4 years and I've had little trouble with it).
I have been very lucky that it's lasted me 10 years, well beyond my expectations but I know the remaining life is limited because at the first sign of large expense I will need to scrap it because it won't be economically viable to repair.
It's a Subaru Legacy 4wd and when things go wrong they are expensive to repair.
For example a lot of jobs require the engine to be removed and it has 4 drive shafts.
It's also the case that in some cases you need genuine parts from Japan (either because factored parts are not available or not receommended).
It does have a number of problems which I haven't fixed for economic reasons.
So basically it has limited shelf life but continues to astound me.

Now - how important is it to get the car serviced annually?

I'm not strapped for cash but I'm also aware of the "If it ain't broke don't fix it" axiom which I do believe in.

Does anyone have any views on whether I should skip servicing (as it might not last another 12 months) and if so how long can I afford to skip it for - 18 months?, 2 years?
I do about 6K miles per year in it and the oil gets topped up as there is a small leak.

Please don't suggest I do it myself.
I am not very strong and sometimes I need help to put oil in it because I can't physically remove the oil cap.
I know I don't have the ability to carry out servicing myself and would rather pay if it's necessary.
It was last serviced about 13-14 months ago, but it fully MOTed, roadworthy etc.

anewman

As for whether servicing is needed or not, the main thing is oil and oil filter changes really. If you don't want to do it yourself, national tyres are probably the cheapest for this. Some people say this should ideally be done every 5000 miles. Also, if it has a cam belt (as opposed to a chain) it is best that this is replaced in line with the manufaturer's recommendations - it costs quite a bit, but can avoid destructive engine damage.

But servicing is intended to keep the car running at it's best and help prevent damage and breakdown etc. It would be a shame for it to die as a result of lack of servicing, but suppose you'd get a couple of hundred from scrapping it and another car.

I would imagine being a subaru it will probably last longer than you think. When the MOT test was done did they have any comments on the overall condition? Did it take much to get it through? Any advisory notices?

lisyloo

Thanks.
The cam belt was done 4 years ago, so I think it can go a bit longer, although I am aware of the issue. I have been told 5 years (or 60,000 miles).
I have a feeling there may be 2 timing belts (everything is always more expensive on a subaru).

It would be a shame for it to die as a result of lack of servicing

My feeling is that this is unlikely. It's pretty robust and I can't think of many things (apart from the cam belt) that would get so serious as to write it off.

When the MOT test was done did they have any comments on the overall condition? Did it take much to get it through? Any advisory notices?

It needed a small amount of welding.
I spent about £140 on it to get it through as it needed some CV joint gaiters as well.
I'm perfectly OK with that, I don't expect it to be free. It's much larger bills that may not be worth paying.

There are lots of things wrong with it e.g.

some rust (fairly small and deteriorating slowly)
one of the front brake disks is warped causing vibration (but I'm assured it's safe)
one of the rear doors won't open from the outside sometimes.
occasional problems with central locking
water comes in through sun roof in heavy rain
there is a noisethat's been coming from the gearbox for years (bearing I think)
occasionally it jumps out of gear (bottom end of 4th)
occasionally it's difficult to get in gear
leaks oil (slowly)
advisories on deteriorated exhaust

The main concern about that lot would be the gearbox/clutch.
I don't know exactly what the problem is but if it's the gearbox failing then that sounds like the sort of thing that might be expensive, on the other hand it's been making a noise for years.
Other things that are expensive are driveshafts because I know (from previous experience) that I will be advised to have the front 2 done together and use genuine parts.

It's not that I have a problem spending money on maintenance, it's just that you get to a point where you will be throwing good money after bad.

I estimate that a newer car will cost me £600 - £1000 in depreciation annually.
So if the additional bills to keep it on the road (in addition to the normal tyres, MOT, servicing etc.) get anywhere near this number, then I'm better off getting myself a newer car. That's a purely hard headed mathematical decision, so I'm pretty clear on where the limit is and I'm nowhere near it at the moment, but I've been expecting it to expire for about the last 4 years.

But servicing is intended to keep the car running at it's best and help prevent damage and breakdown etc.

I have also had the problem of fixing a leak (air leak) on an old car and that caused problems down the line - presumably as the other old parts could not now withstand the proper pressure coming from the newly fixed part. It's certainly possible in my view to "disturb" an old engine that working fine.
Hence the "if it ain't broke don't fix it" axiom.

There are certainly advantages of having an odler car.
The depreciation is £0, the insurance is very cheap but above all I don't have to worry about it.
A few weeks ago I scraped my husband car on the driveway - oops ........
His need to have a expensive repair, but I didn't even look at mine for a few days to be honest.
Stone chips, scratches, bumps, they just aren't an issue.
If we are leaving our car anywhere (like an airport car park) then it's great totake mine because we don't have to worry about every minor ding as you would with a newer car.

Thunderbird_2

Hi

As anewman said, the minimuim to do is an oil and filter change, £20 by natinal tyres. I would not worry about the rest as much as I would about oil.

If you have got 10 months or more of MOT on it, then I would go the extra mile and replace the air filter.

Good luck

anewman

lisyloo wrote: »

water comes in through sun roof in heavy rain

If it is leaking between the seal and the glass... Open sunroof (remove the glass if it can be done easily, on my car a bit slides out which locks the glass in). Clean the seal gently, and smear silicone grease on the seal (you can get some in maplins).

lisyloo wrote: »

leaks oil (slowly)

Oil leaks are nothing much to worry about, and all the oil coating the underside of the car helps prevent rust .

redux

Does the sunroof leak around the edge of its glass, or somewhere else? A problem I once had was that the drain channels had got blocked with leaf debris or whatever, and then the day after a thunderstorm I had water coming from under the back seat.

Conor_3

Make sure you do an oil and filter change. Change the airfilter which is something you can do yourself. Get a free brake inspection done at Kwik-Fit to make sure the pads aren't worn too low.

TBH, I'd just get a £60 basic oil, filters and plugs service at one of the national chains and then if its still running in 12 months time, do another.

You really want that brake disc sorting though because if you don't, it'll wreck the suspension bushes and steering rack.

Jamp

Do you know if your Legacy's engine is DOHC (quad cam) or SOHC? Hopefully it's the latter as then it is a non interferance engine so a broken cambelt wouldn't ruin it. They all run a single cambelt but they're longer than normal due to the horizontally opposed ("flat-four/six" or "boxer") engines.

The Subaru engines do have quite narrow oil ways so regular changes are preferred. I would stick with 6k/12 month oil and filter change intervals or stretch it out to 9k/18 months at a push, but skip changing the air filter, plugs, fuel filter, gearbox oil etc unless you have problems with something.

vaio

If it’s got to 136k there is no reason for it not to get to 200k as long as it has oil changes and cam belts. Plugs & air filters might make it run a bit better and maybe use less petrol

I’d do the oil changes and make sure the gearbox and diff oil is topped up.

There is a certain logic that says if you have a £500 car that needs a new clutch which will cost say £500 it might still be worth doing as if you do you end up with a known reliable car with a new clutch as opposed to replacing it with another £500 car which will be of unknown reliability and will not have a new clutch

goldspanners

i know you say its reliable and roadworthy,but if you are scared of expensive repair bills why not sell it while it has life left in it and get a few quid for it,then buy something else ith a bit less to go wrong with it? maybe get something with only 2wd and a timing chain? an older merc perhaps?

lisyloo

if it’s got to 136k there is no reason for it not to get to 200k as long as it has oil changes and cam belts.

The main reason is that expensive parts - like driveshafts etc. can start to fail and on this type of car parts and labour are expensive.
On the parts side, sometimes you can't get factored parts or they are not very successful in which case the mechanic will recommend genuine parts.
On the labour side there are a number of jobs that require the engine to be removed which puts up the cost and of course 4 driveshafts instead of 1 etc.
Also it has some rust and has starting needing welding.

It's just a case of economics really.
If you have work that required £600 spent on it then you ahve to consider whether it's worth spending that (because all the other parts of the car are old and could fail at any time) or do you put it towards a new car.
I'm fairly clear on where the diving line is because I have estimated what the depreciation is likely to be on a new car.
There is no point spending more on maintenance and having a car that breaks down all the time when you could spend the same on a much nicer newer car that uses less petrol.

you end up with a known reliable car with a new clutch

But everything else is still 18 years old and therefore you can't count on it lasting and not getting other bills.
In fact the expectation would be that after 18 years that other parts start to fail as well.

as opposed to replacing it with another £500 car which will be of unknown reliability

I can see that argument but I wouldn't do that.
I would put the £500 towards a £6000 car.
No-one can predict what you willl get but I always get them checked out mechnically and it will most likely compare very favourably with an 18 year old car.
We have rejected 2 cars and got deposits back after vehicle inspections, so we do take all sensible precautions (which I know isn't a guarnatee).