We're aware that some users are experiencing technical issues which the team are working to resolve. See the Community Noticeboard for more info. Thank you for your patience.
📨 Have you signed up to the Forum's new Email Digest yet? Get a selection of trending threads sent straight to your inbox daily, weekly or monthly!

Budget 2017: Cost of mobile roaming outside the EU set to rise

Options
MSE_Luke
MSE_Luke Posts: 295 MSE Staff
Fourth Anniversary
Mobile roaming outside the EU will be subject to UK VAT, the Chancellor has announced...
Read the full story:
'Budget 2017: Cost of mobile roaming outside the EU set to rise'
OfficialStamp.gif
Click reply below to discuss. If you haven’t already, join the forum to reply. If you aren’t sure how it all works, read our New to Forum? Intro Guide.

Comments

  • Atasas
    Atasas Posts: 753 Forumite
    Lets say, little honour in political circles....

    Networks do not pay VAT between international usage trading, it is only our consumers, that will have this levy to pay...
  • redux
    redux Posts: 22,976 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    edited 8 March 2017 at 7:26PM
    !The article quotes Mr Hammond thus:
    In his Budget speech this afternoon, Chancellor Philip Hammond said the Government plans to roll out measures that will "introduce UK VAT on roaming telecoms outside the EU in line with international standard practice".

    I think he is making a possibly incorrect statement there.

    From Wikipedia

    In order to avoid double taxation, non-taxation or the distortion of competition, an EU member state may, in accordance with Article 9(3)(a) of Council Directive 77/388 ("the Sixth VAT Directive"), include within the scope of its national VAT any telecommunications services used within its territory but billed outside the EU VAT area. When opting to do so, it must also exempt from its national VAT any roaming services supplied by home networks within its territory but used outside the EU VAT area. The inclusion of telecommunications within the scope of Article 9 was requested by the United Kingdom,[26] which subsequently enacted the change under Article 19 of the Value Added Tax (Place of Supply of Services) Order 1992. Consequently, when an EU member state makes this VAT exemption, roaming on networks in the Åland Islands, Gibraltar, Iceland, Liechtenstein, Norway, the Canary Islands, Ceuta, Melilla and French overseas departments is subject to the price caps with no VAT applied, because these countries and territories are within the EEA but outside the EU VAT area.

    That can be read as if it also applies to countries geographically outside the EU

    I just looked at and translated a couple of pages about German customers roaming outside the EU. In theory regulations provide that use outside the EU is not subject to MwSt (VAT).

    Maybe each EU country has some discretion about how it applies the rules, and that is what Mr Hammond is relying on.

    I also looked up 4 other random countries

    Customers of mobile networks of Australia Malaysia New Zealand and Singapore do not suffer GST on their roaming fees.

    Maybe Mr Hammond is making some changes as if we had already left the EU, but reciprocal arrangements for taxation of roaming fees from EU customers coming here and us going abroad will surely be amongst the negotiations that will occur soon, and we don't want to end up with double taxation. We may be in or not in the Single Market, but are they going to dump international tax arrangements with the EU and with other non-EU countries?

    Whatever happens in those negotiations, his declaration that this is international standard practice is untrue for all of the first 5 countries I looked up.
  • boatman
    boatman Posts: 4,700 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper
    The prices for using your mobile outside the EU are crazy high as it is, adding VAT is just adding insult to injury. I would always buy a local sim if it were needed and try to rely on WiFi.
  • eDicky
    eDicky Posts: 6,835 Forumite
    Ninth Anniversary 1,000 Posts Name Dropper
    All non-EU roaming charges can be avoided by using a dual-SIM phone, with your UK network SIM in one slot and a local SIM from a network in the country you are visiting in the other.

    Any SMS can be replied to directly, selecting SIM2 to send it. Instead of answering an incoming call to SIM1 (UK SIM), refuse it and call back using SIM2. Call and SMS costs vary widely according to country etc, but in the vast majority of cases it will be cheaper to do this than pay the outrageous roaming charges. A data package on the local SIM will usually be relatively cheap also.

    The same can be done by carrying two handsets of course, but much less convenient when you cannot respond directly to the number calling and have to type it in to the other phone.

    I've not used a single SIM phone since well before the advent of smartphones, nor paid any non-EU roaming charges.
    Evolution, not revolution
  • leslieknope
    leslieknope Posts: 334 Forumite
    soon we'll be outside of the eu. i wonder what that will mean for all of these mobile 'feel at home' or free eu roaming deals.
    CCCC #33: £42/£240
    DFW: £4355/£4405
This discussion has been closed.
Meet your Ambassadors

🚀 Getting Started

Hi new member!

Our Getting Started Guide will help you get the most out of the Forum

Categories

  • All Categories
  • 351K Banking & Borrowing
  • 253.1K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
  • 453.6K Spending & Discounts
  • 244K Work, Benefits & Business
  • 599K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
  • 176.9K Life & Family
  • 257.4K Travel & Transport
  • 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
  • 16.1K Discuss & Feedback
  • 37.6K Read-Only Boards

Is this how you want to be seen?

We see you are using a default avatar. It takes only a few seconds to pick a picture.