Living on $12,000 a year

ceridwen · 16 August 2007 at 7:08PM

Hi everyone - I see comments by dolly day dream and moany moany - thanks for that - re exploitation of workers making the quilts. Certainly in last couple of days there has been stuff in the media again re the pay and conditions of workers (in China in this case) making cheapie goods for the West (Chinese toys is coming to mind right now).

It is a thing that is bothering me personally - that there is so little fair trade produce of any description available. Food is a good start - but there is very little even there. Anything else - virtually zilch so far and what there is tends to be in the expensive ranges. Also there is the fact that apparently not very much of the fairtrade premium goes to the workers. I personally am suspicious when I buy goods at pocket money prices - and feel that perhaps if I spent, say, 50% more again - with a cast-iron guarantee that all that "premium" would go to the workers then that would be well worthwhile. I myself would be prepared to pay that - with that guarantee. I am not rolling in money (chance would be a fine thing!) - but I would prefer not to worry that whatever item I have just bought hasnt come at the expense of someone else's misery.

As regards the Chinese prisoners - that might be all well and good IF all those prisoners were criminals. BUT, as I understand it, many Chinese prisoners arent criminals at all - just, for instance, members of a religion the State does not agree with (ie Falun Gong). I have had a brief look at Falun Gong - and, as far as I can see, they arent doing anything wrong at all - just holding a perfectly peaceful, legitimate belief system (nowt wrong with that).

rosieben · 16 August 2007 at 7:16PM

I agree 100% Ceri, I'm not well off, but I would prefer to buy goods that will give the worker a fair return on his time and effort. Its so difficult as you say, but it is good that people are becoming so much more aware of these things now. People power will win in the end I believe.

Love your siggie - i dont do greed either, the least attractive of human traits!

ceridwen · 16 August 2007 at 7:28PM

thanks rosieben - really appreciate your contribution. Now what was that phrase - something along lines of "there is enough in the world for everyones need - but not for anyones greed" - something like that anyway. Obviously, we in the West, have proportionately more of the worlds resources anyway and - yes I'm human - I tend to judge myself by British standards, not world standards. I'm a work in progress - as I stated previously! But it does come to mind that greed is one of the "7 deadly sins". In this day and age of moral relativism - is that the phrase I want? it feels odd to even try and aspire to certain moral standards (and - believe me - I am very very human - but one does have to at least have some inkling of aspiring to them I guess!).

ceridwen · 16 August 2007 at 7:41PM

Deleted - amended

ceridwen · 16 August 2007 at 7:44PM

Deleted - amended.

dolly_day_dream · 16 August 2007 at 9:59PM

I have not been brought up in any religion - my father was totally against it - but have always lived by my own code of ethics. However I do find that these days my actions re anti-globalisation, peace protesting, eco-warrioring? fair trade, CND, veganism, recycling etc are more and more developing an almost religious zeal. I find myself questioning nearly every action I take and how it might impact on the world. Yes sometimes it is more expensive but often the ethical alternative isn't - ie using charity shops for clothes It makes me question what I really need as opposed to want. For interest there is a campaign about sweatshops at
http://www.nosweat.org.uk/
which highlights the abuses and provides leaflets you can print out.

Hardup_Hester · 17 August 2007 at 7:33AM

Although I worry about exploitation of workers, organic food, recycling etc I don't always feel in a position to follow my consience, maybe I could explain why.
I buy my clothes from charity shops or Ebay, so does this count? Someone was still exploited when the clothing was made. I bought 4 pairs of shoes in a sale 15 years ago, the last pair has been mended many times but now needs to be thrown away & I have just replaced them with 4 more pairs, hopefully they will last me another 15 years.
I support myself & my disabled partner for 9 months of the year. After the mortgage & bills are paid I'm left with just under £20 a week to cover food, petrol/fares, clothing & everything else.
I run a car as without it hubby would not be able to work at all, if I use the car to travel to work I spend less than £5 on petrol, if I travel by bus the fare is £12 a week. I walk as often as possible, but if the weathers is really wet I take the car as I do not wish to spend all day in wet clothes. Sometimes I take the car as I am too tired to walk, I walk about 5 miles a day in the course of my work, usually walking fast & carrying 5 to 15 kilos of paper. In the warmer weather the temperature in my room is 98 to 100 degrees, the dress code is 'business ready' so no shorts, sleeveless tshirts, no flip flops etc.
With regards to Organic/Fair trade food, I find the cost prohibitive, at our local farmers market I was charged £8.50 for 2 pork chops & £2.50 for 6 eggs that were not even very fresh. Also being extremely cynical, I would not trust any of the big suppliers no to pass ordinary food off as organic to increase their profits. And after seeing the TV footage of the appaling treatment meted out to the turkeys on a supposed 'RSPCA' endorsed farm, why would I pay extra for that?
Even if I had oddles of money I would still not buy organic food unless I was sure of the supplier, but that's just me being very cynical!
On a lighter note, my BIL rang up yesterday, he wanted to know if the 5 of them could come over for Sunday lunch as they are broke, they had to sell one of their cars, a 3 month old Jag, as they have realised they NEED a £42,000 BMW as they can't get all 3 baby seats in the back of the Jag, it's a hard life for some.
Hester

moanymoany · 17 August 2007 at 8:17AM

Hester, I share your sentiments. Costs can be prohibitive. Shopping locally (if you can) is not always even the same price and very often not such good quality. Farmers Markets are expensive and even if I was prepared to pay the prices or could afford it as they are not weekly in most places it is not possible.

I know what you mean about trusting the labels. I know that the 'fair trade' label is often given to companies who give their employees only a very little extra in the way of pay and benefits. These companies are often owned by foreigners, not locals. They then whack on a surcharge - most of which they must pocket.

Choosing a company that one thinks is ok is not always a guarantee of success.

However, I do the best I can and I am satisfied with that. I will sign petitions and give money to charities that help people. If it is cheaper to use the car I use it. I believe that if everyone did a bit things would improve. By living frugally I believe we do our bit.

rosieben · 17 August 2007 at 1:21PM

Hester and Moany, I agree with all you said. I’m very cynical about all food manufacturers’ motives and ethics. I try to buy local produce where possible but would never pay extra just because something is labelled ‘organic’ - just don’t trust them!!

I’ve recently made the decision not to buy anything new unless I absolutely have to, with few exceptions – meds, underwear! I’ll buy from ebay, car boots or charity shops; I thought about the fact that I’ll still buy things made in sweat shops; however, the money I pay isn’t going to the owners of the sweat shops so I am happy that I’m not encouraging the practice, in fact I’m reducing their profits by buying used goods.

I really admire you for managing so well on your income, Hester. Hats off to you!!

Moany, I think you hit the nail on the head - by living frugally we're doing our bit.

sarah0404 · 17 August 2007 at 8:38PM

Hi, thanks for the interesting thread! I have another link to post, which is kind of along the same lines as some of the others. http://www.littlebrowndress.com/index.htm The woman made a dress, then wore it every day for a year as an experiment. There are lots of pictures and a blog about it. I see she has started a new project, but i've not had the time to check that out yet.

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Living on $12,000 a year

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