economy seven & ten tariffs

chris89_2 · 13 January 2006 at 11:37AM

Has anybody that has economy 7 or 10 tariff tried to switch utility supplier? Are there other companies offering these other than Powergen? If so and successful doew it work ok and who is responsible for turning the time clocks on/off at the right times?

penrhyn · 13 January 2006 at 12:25PM

I had economy 7 with powergen, and switched to Scottish power who do E7 tarrifs. Try the energy helpline to find others.
The time switches are radio controlled using the Rugby Time standard. If you have one of the old mechanical ones get it changed. Your supplier will arrange this, its usually Siemens that come round on behalf of them.
One more thing do you really need economy 7? It really only worth while is you have storage heaters, immersion heater, and a lot of washing/drying.

Bri_2205 · 13 January 2006 at 1:47PM

If it's E7, all suppliers support this. If it's E10 (which I believe involves 2 supply points), there are only a few suppliers that support this. Npower & Powergen being the only 2 that spring to mind atm.

Do you get an afternoon boost? If so, this is probably the case.

paul_h · 13 January 2006 at 1:57PM

There are no problems changing economy7 suppliers, but the various economy10 or 'heatwise' tariffs can be a problem. Only a few suppliers support these, and some only support these tariffs in particular areas of the country, making it even more complicated.

There are a number of different arrangements for supplying e10, some installations have the two supply points, some just have a simple arrangement similar to e7 but with a different timeclock.

Depending on your region, try Npower & Powergen as suggested above, but also try Scottish Power, SWEB, or Manweb.

chris89_2 · 13 January 2006 at 8:51PM

Many thanks. We have E10 and are v happy & warm in our 3bed cottage. We use our services (immersion, electric shwr, wash & tum dryer & dish washer wisely and our last 12 mth bill was about £745. And that's not having the electric shower for 6 mths of it. This equated to our previous year ie 2004 of about the same for Gas & elect in a smaller sq foot area 4 bed house on top of which we paid £150p.a for boiler maintenance! We looked at installing gas CH but would take years to recover any savings and that was before latest lot of price hikes!

gerryfitz · 13 January 2006 at 9:14PM

This makes interesting reading.

My daughter has just moved into a new flat with E10 system and I was going to see what was the best option on Uswitch, but she's with Powergen now so that may be the best option, given the above comments.

Also, I'm a bit mystified, there are two separate cables (and switches) that run into the immersion heater, can anyone suggest why there are two, are they for separate times of the day/night, and do they need to be on all the time.

The previous owner was useless when we asked her, she hasn't lived there for 3 years and said she can't remember (it's been rented out for last 3 years).

Any ideas would be appreciated.

Regards,

Gerry

penrhyn · 14 January 2006 at 11:07AM

The E10 system will be on a separate radio controlled circuit so it comes on only at the low rate times.
I would imagine that a second circuit has been added to the immersion to allow it to be switched on at other times, if the water is a bit cold.
its quite important to find out which switch does what as you will be paying for full rate units if you are running off the untimed circuit. Check what happens to the meter when you swich each one in turn.

chas1937 · 14 January 2006 at 11:41AM

At present I have 1 meter but 2 supply numbers on bill from Scottish power it says
ComfortPlusWhite meter:Control---2113 units@3.446=£72.81
ComfortPlusWhitemeter:Night

334 units@3.848=£12.85
ComfortPlusWhitemeter:Day

296 units@8.916=£26.39
Standing Charge:51 days@19.810=£10.10
Total £122.15
Plus 5% Vat=£128.2575
that was period from17/10/05 too6/12/05

Does this mean i,m on economy7 or another tariff altogether as cant get a comparison as doesnt say if it is or not.I,m in 2 bedroom-mid terrace with full double glazing,cavity wall insulation,loft insulation and use energy bulbs.Does this look fair price as I stay in Glasgow area

paul_h · 14 January 2006 at 11:46AM

gerryfitz wrote:

Also, I'm a bit mystified, there are two separate cables (and switches) that run into the immersion heater, can anyone suggest why there are two, are they for separate times of the day/night, and do they need to be on all the time.

From your description, it sounds like you have a proper economy7 cylinder - I assume there are two switches with separate cables connected to separate immersion heaters. Standard cylinders usually have the immersion heater head on the top, economy7 cylinders usually have the two heaters on the side of the cylinder.

The lower of the two heaters will be connected to the economy 7 circuit and will use off-peak electricity to charge the cylinder with hot water overnight, the upper heater is for boosting the hot water if you require more hot water later in the day - as it is higher up, it heats up less of the cylinder to save electricity - you rely on the off-peak heater for the bulk of your hot water.

First of all, identify which switch is for the top immersion heater, and which is for the bottom immersion heater.

Leave the heater at the BOTTOM switched ON all the time, it will only come on at night, using cheap off-peak electricity.

Switch on the TOP heater as/when required if you need more hot water later in the day - this is the boost heater and uses peak rate electricity.

Some leave the boost on to maintain the cylinder water temperature during the day (there is a thermostat in each immersion heater) but it will increase electricity usage. However, economy 7 cylinders are bigger than standard ones and should provide most of the hot water needed if fully charged overnight on off-peak electricity.

Hope this helps!

paul_h · 14 January 2006 at 12:12PM

chas1937 wrote:

At present I have 1 meter but 2 supply numbers on bill from Scottish power it says
ComfortPlusWhite meter:Control---2113 units@3.446=£72.81
ComfortPlusWhitemeter:Night
334 units@3.848=£12.85
ComfortPlusWhitemeter:Day
296 units@8.916=£26.39
Standing Charge:51 days@19.810=£10.10
Total £122.15
Plus 5% Vat=£128.2575
that was period from17/10/05 too6/12/05

Does this mean i,m on economy7 or another tariff altogether as cant get a comparison as doesnt say if it is or not... Does this look fair price as I stay in Glasgow area

The Scottish 'White meter' tariffs often do not exactly conform to economy7 or economy10 tariffs and this can make it a problem when wanting to switch suppliers. This could be either as it's controlled by your timeswitch - you would need to confirm the off-peak times with your supplier.

The two supply numbers mean that it is likely that your heating is on a separate supply number (the 'ComfortPlusWhite meter:Control' element of your bill). This also makes it difficult to switch as most new suppliers will only accept single supply number customers. It is possible to have this arrangement removed and a standard economy7 switching/metering/billing arrangement with a single supply number installed, although it is likely that it would be at your own considerable expense. I notice that your rate for heating is slightly lower than your normal off-peak, economy7 has only one off-peak rate.

In any case, the rates you are paying seem OK, although rates do vary greatly across the country - you could try comparing with the economy7 rates of other suppliers in your area. The different suppliers seem much closer in price now than they were, say, 12 months ago.

Hope this helps!

chas1937 · 14 January 2006 at 12:50PM

Thanks Paul and that now seems to make sense of the trouble i have been having between Staywarm and Scottish Power.I transferred too Staywarm in Sept 2001 and couple of months ago got call from Scottish Power saying that there had been erroneous transfer.What happened next was Staywarm transferred me back too Scottish Power who have now transfered me back to Staywarm.It was because of that second supply number that wasnt transferred and that has now been resolved.So Staywarm have now sent me back all the money that I paid too them(although that was bit of a fight with Energywatch getting involved.So now just waithing on Scottish Power bill coming in which would have been dearer so they have decided to give me 25% discount on it and that should be end of matter,I hope.Thanks again

economy seven & ten tariffs

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