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Exchange Traded Funds, an alternative way to invest.

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  • tradetime
    tradetime Posts: 3,200 Forumite
    Ok so far on the UK market this is what I have found, as mentioned above:

    iShares A small selction which give access to a resonably general take on various regions such as UK, Europe, Asia and the US largely based on their major indices. Along with some Fixed Income products

    ETF SecuritiesThis one gives access to quite a broad range of commodities and some commodities related stock indices. Also includes leverage and short options, the latter should be approached with caution unless you are familiar.

    Along side those;

    Deutche Bank DBX trackers This is possibly one of the most promising ETF providers I have found outside the US.

    A listing in ETF encyclopedia Not the most comprehensive but I'll include it anyway.

    Unfortunately I haven't come across much in the way of commetary on ETF's or knowledge base type stuff in the UK outside of the Forum arena.
    Hope for the best.....Plan for the worst!

    "Never in the history of the world has there been a situation so bad that the government can't make it worse." Unknown
  • ozzage
    ozzage Posts: 518 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture Combo Breaker
    I'm looking forward to Vanguard starting up here. Will be interesting to see what ETFs they choose to offer on the UK market and what it does to the costs...
  • ozzage
    ozzage Posts: 518 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture Combo Breaker
    There is also Lyxor here

    http://www.lyxoretf.co.uk/

    The site is currently down though.

    And a few here:

    http://www.invescopowershares.co.uk/portal/site/ukprops/ouretfs/fullrange
  • ozzage
    ozzage Posts: 518 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture Combo Breaker
    tradetime wrote: »
    Hi ozzage, did they give you a reason why you can't trade it?

    Not really. They did mumble something about USD but it was clear that they had no idea.
  • tradetime
    tradetime Posts: 3,200 Forumite
    ozzage wrote: »
    Not really. They did mumble something about USD but it was clear that they had no idea.
    The dollar thing shouldn't be a problem to them, you maybe from a currency risk, but not them, here are the 3 they have told me they have added to their list and are available for me to purchse, you will note these are US listed ETF's and thus priced in USD

    Wisdom Tree International Basic Materials (DBN)

    Market Vectors Agribusiness (MOO)

    Invesco Powershares Agriculture (DBA)
    Hope for the best.....Plan for the worst!

    "Never in the history of the world has there been a situation so bad that the government can't make it worse." Unknown
  • tradetime
    tradetime Posts: 3,200 Forumite
    ozzage wrote: »
    I can't always do what I want because of lack of availability of ETFs or because my broker (Interactive Investor) doesn't let me trade them. For example I was considering buying a shipping ETF (SHPP) but I can't trade it, which is frustrating.
    Not really. They did mumble something about USD but it was clear that they had no idea.
    There are two of those listed with ETF Securities, this one is listed in Sterling
    http://www.etfsecurities.com/fund/etfs_fund_shipping_large_cap_gb_en.asp

    This one in USD
    http://www.etfsecurities.com/fund/etfs_fund_shipping_large_cap_en.asp
    Hope for the best.....Plan for the worst!

    "Never in the history of the world has there been a situation so bad that the government can't make it worse." Unknown
  • tradetime
    tradetime Posts: 3,200 Forumite
    ozzage wrote: »
    I'm looking forward to Vanguard starting up here. Will be interesting to see what ETFs they choose to offer on the UK market and what it does to the costs...

    Yes I read report that they were planning on moving into the UK, problem is they'll likely offer a lot of what is already here, they do offer some sector specific stuff in the US, although I have never used them, as I've always found what I wanted elsewhere, but any competitionin this market is good.
    Hope for the best.....Plan for the worst!

    "Never in the history of the world has there been a situation so bad that the government can't make it worse." Unknown
  • tradetime
    tradetime Posts: 3,200 Forumite
    On the US front regarding ETF's I'll start with the commentary type resourses, at least the ones I use on a regular basis, I'm sure there are more

    Seeking Alpha Takes you to the ETF section, but the site itself covers a range of US orientated investment topics.

    ETF Trends

    ETF Guide
    Hope for the best.....Plan for the worst!

    "Never in the history of the world has there been a situation so bad that the government can't make it worse." Unknown
  • timarr
    timarr Posts: 18 Forumite
    I think, between you, you've captured most of what's available in the UK. There's also the Munro Fund, a fundamental index tracker based around forecast earnings (sorry, as a new user I can't post a link). The manager, Rob Davies, posts over on The Motley Fool as LordEssex.

    On the ISA / US ETF thing I'd guess this is because ISA regulations only allow UK listed shares to be included - I've never checked but I'm pretty sure ETF's are listed and treated like shares rather than closed end funds. If so I'd be a bit surprised that any provider would allow them to be included - it's worth double checking this because I've been caught before where the provider allowed me to buy a stock, then decided it didn't qualify and dumped it without my knowledge.

    Personally I wouldn't buy a US tracker because of the currency risk but it'd be nice to have a bit more choice. Some of the TER's on UK index funds are ridiculous.

    timarr
  • tradetime
    tradetime Posts: 3,200 Forumite
    timarr wrote: »
    If you're investing in ETF's just be careful what the underlying investments are. Few examples.

    Some of the commodity ETF's last year ran into problems because it turned out they were underpinned by derivative contracts with AIG, the big US insurer that ran into huge financial problems and had to be bailed out by the US government. Having ETF's underpinned by complex derivatives may not be a bad thing but it probably exposes you to a different kind of risk than you were expecting.
    Hi Timarr, that's very true, largely as I recall they were the ETF Securities Family that trade here in the UK, that issue has since been resolved, but it does highlight a point that you should always know what you are investing in. I don't trade those so I haven't looked at their structure yet, but it almost sounds like they are actually ETN's these are often falsely referred to as ETF's and are essentially a debt instrument issued by a provider and expose you to credit risk of the issuer. ETN's have the advantage of very accurate tracking of an underlying index but particularly in these times pose an added risk, I would personally advise people to try and find a fund rather than a note until after this crisis passes, or take a very close look at the issuer, and underwriter.
    timarr wrote: »
    Most share based ETF's will track some index or other and the label "index tracker" tends to make people feel that these are inherently safe (or at least as safe as possible in the risk ridden world of stocks). As ever, though, the investment industry can't leave a good thing alone so now it's inventing new indices to track against. This can be useful if you know what you're doing in order to get specific sector exposure, but you still need to be careful.

    Understanding how the underlying indices are managed is important. Take the Corporate Bond ETF from iShares (SLXX). This, even now, is heavily based on the corporate bonds issued by banks and other financials. So what might seem to be a simple play on corporate bonds recovering before the stockmarket does (historically they do) is actually a bit of a gamble on government intervention. The underlying index here is adjusted quarterly so the next update is due next week.

    Sticking to straightforward broad based index tracking ETF's like the iShares 250 is fine, but some of the other stuff is an accident waiting to happen.

    timarr
    Again good point to make, but provided you are prepared to do the homework then you can mitigate a lot of the risk. As I said in my original post, this area is for the slightly more adventurous, for those who need hand holding they would possibly be much safer staying with unit trusts etc
    Hope for the best.....Plan for the worst!

    "Never in the history of the world has there been a situation so bad that the government can't make it worse." Unknown
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