outrageous mobile charge from UAE call to UK number which I don't recognise

kblack71 · 8 November 2018 at 6:02PM

Hi there. I haven't posted here before but maybe someone can help. I was recently in the UAE, in Abu Dhabi, with my roaming switched OFF, I made a number of whatsapp and facetime calls while there and when I received my phone bill, instead of it being £9 for the month, it was £214, with a call from the UAE to a UK mobile costing £205 for 41 minutes. I have no record of having made this call, my phne doesn't log this as one of the calls I made, nor have I ever come across the number before, it's certainly not in my phone's address book.
After a few calls to Virgin they've offered me £20 off the bill which, naturally I haven't accepted.
The only possible explanation I can imagine a this point is that I made a 40minute facetime call on the same evening and I'm wondering if a scammer might have been able to 're-route' or re-direct this to a different number thereby causing me to be charged at this ridiculous rate, which is in fact the correct rate from the UAE. I've no idea if scammers are capable of such tricks but what else could it be?
I told the 'manager' at Virgin not to go ahead with the 'deadlock letter' she mentioned until tomorrow, which would then mean my going through an independent ombudsman, but this can take ages, so I was hoping to find a better alternative. She'll be ringing me up again tomorrow afternoon and if I haven't made any progress I may then decide to go ahead with the ombudsman. In any case this manager seemed fairly low down the ranking and didn't have any understanding of anything beyond the basics, and yet she didn't allow me to speak to her supervisor, claiming "they don't take calls".
Any help would be greatly appreciated.

pmduk · 8 November 2018 at 9:36PM

If you've been offered a deadlock letter already, then the network is sticking by its bill and your alternative is to go down the ADR route.

I suspect the Facetime app has chosen to route the call via the mobile network rather than using mobile data. This is all the more likely because Facetime is not permitted in the UAE. Google the number the call was made to.

If this is the case accept the network's generous offer with both hands and say thank you.

ballyblack · 8 November 2018 at 11:04PM

Good to know that info

Does UAE allow WhatsApp calls?

kblack71 · 8 November 2018 at 11:22PM

Yes Whasapp and skype are allowed but the quality was very poor (possibly intentionally), which explains why I tried facetime.
I feel the mobile provider, in my case Virgin should have mentioned this, or I should have been given the option to accept or reject the call being re-routed to ordinary £5 / minute call.

kblack71 · 8 November 2018 at 11:24PM

Thanks pmduk. I am still puzzled as to why the number was different to the facetime number

pmduk · 9 November 2018 at 10:45AM

kblack71 wrote: »

I feel the mobile provider, in my case Virgin should have mentioned this, or I should have been given the option to accept or reject the call being re-routed to ordinary £5 / minute call.

No mobile network has control over the actions of apps, whether pre-installed by manufacturers or the customers themselves. Neither can they usually offer any effective support for them.

kblack71 · 9 November 2018 at 12:12PM

Assuming I can't get any more sense out of the Virgin staff I'm able to speak with, I've decided not to accept the measly £20 and to make an independent complaint through resolver (in association with money saving expert), my argument being twofold :
1, I have no idea who the number I'm claimed to have rung belongs to, the number is +44 7953 939 675, furthermore, I am unable to send a text to this number or even get through if I try calling so clearly I'm contesting ever having made a 41 minute call to this number.
2, if Facetime can be rerouted via the ordinary phone line then I believe I should have been alerted of this. Imagine the number of UK citizens in the UAE who might try using facetime.
If I've missed anything or if anyone has anything else to add, I'd be most grateful.

pmduk · 9 November 2018 at 12:37PM

Once a network has issued a deadlock letter your further recourse is to CISAS, (in this case, or the ADR of the network's choice). Any further complaints to the network on the same issue, even via Resolver, will not be considered.

If you're unhappy with the behaviour of the app, you should be complaining to Facetime. Its developers are the ones who control its behaviours and actions. Not the networks.

If you're now suggesting denying ever making a 40-minute call via Facetime in order to defraud a network then you're on your own.

ETA

kblack71 wrote: »

2, if Facetime can be rerouted via the ordinary phone line then I believe I should have been alerted of this. Imagine the number of UK citizens in the UAE who might try using facetime.

I've never used Facetime, but I'm pretty certain that it will have asked for permission to make phone calls before first use. Apps have to do this.

kblack71 · 9 November 2018 at 2:06PM

No I'm not denying ever making a facetime call, that's not what I said. What I did say was that I do not know the number I'm supposed to have rung, and the 40 minute facetime call was to a completely different number

Herongull · 9 November 2018 at 2:19PM

Is there any way you can check the time of the Facetime call and compare it with the call that Virgin claimed you made?

If they match, then this makes it virtually certain that Facetime must have routed the call through the phone network. This is nothing to do with Virgin as they have no control over the settings or behaviour of an app.

You said the Facetime call duration matched the Virgin call and it was the same evening so even if you can't find out the exact time it is still very likely that Facetime caused the bill.

If this is the cause, it really is your bill.

It could have been much worse - what if you were making Facetime calls every day on your trip?

kblack71 · 9 November 2018 at 2:58PM

Thanks for your help Herongull.
My FaceTime call of 40 mins was made at 20.33, there was also a 48 second call made at 20.28, (but no call of this length features on the virgin bill), the virgin bill states the time of the 41-minute call as 19.47. However you do the maths, it doesn’t quite add up, and it’s still a different number.

outrageous mobile charge from UAE call to UK number which I don't recognise

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