DWP overpayment after death

cptkwoman · 12 January 2017 at 5:16PM

Hi, My Mum passed away in autumn 2015. We used the Tell Us Once service a few days later, thereby notifying the DWP.

Despite this, within a few weeks, the DWP wrote to me to ask for repayment of overpayments after death for Mum's pension, pension credit and AA. The overpayment letters state that "when public funds are incorrectly paid we are obliged to ask for them to be refunded". It is unclear to me whether this means the estate is liable for the overpayments, or whether they are just asking politely.

It took us until last August to deal with the probate etc. After that, we had a letter from the Recovery from Estates Debt Management team asking us to complete a form listing the assets of the estate. After we sent this back, they responded with a letter saying that "we have compared the assets in the estate with current departmental records and confirm that these assets were correctly taken into account. This concludes our enquiry."

I am a bit confused, and wondered if someone here could enlighten me, please? We haven't yet paid back the overpayments from the DWP. Does the letter from Recovery from Estates mean that there is now no debt to be paid?

Many thanks!

TELLIT01 · 12 January 2017 at 5:24PM

It takes time for the information provided to Tell Us Once to filter down to the various parts of DWP, so it's often the case that a payment will have been made between the date of death and them being informed.
Is there a phone number on the letter?

cptkwoman · 12 January 2017 at 5:54PM

Thanks, TELLIT01. There is indeed a phone number, which of course would be the easy option!

pmlindyloo · 12 January 2017 at 5:58PM

You do need to telephone them.

The letter you were originally sent is often sent when someone has passed away.

They check to see whether any benefits were incorrectly paid over previous years. The last letter seems to indicate that the benefits were correctly paid.

The only other matter is whether the last payments were made after the death. This sometimes happen if the bank account wasn't frozen immediately.

Telephone and see whether there are overpayments made after the date of the death. You can also check the bank account to see if this happened.

Mersey_2 · 12 January 2017 at 6:23PM

These are standard, system-produced letters which are sent out by the DWP.

The Select Committee recommended they are, 'not fit for purpose' in that: around 70% do not reply and only 20% 're-pay' the purported sums owed; around half of the letters sought less than £100 in any event; and the majority of 'overpayments' are largely due to the DWP's own systems in delaying in actioning the notification of death and as such are official error.

In short, it's costing the State more to produce this bureaucracy than it recovers; but, such is life.

From memory the newish Secretary of State said a review of a dozen or so letters within the DWP estate is currently being undertaken so we should know within months (and before the Summer recess) whether they are to be ended.

If your question meant: does the DWP pursue these historic 'debts' - the answer was in fewer than 1% of estates; so it's a moral rather than a practical obligation in reality.

TELLIT01 · 12 January 2017 at 6:59PM

I had the same letter when my mother died. He state pension was paid to her account between the date of death and the day I registered the death. The payment wasn't large, but they wanted it back!

rockingbilly · 12 January 2017 at 7:02PM

Mersey wrote: »

These are standard, system-produced letters which are sent out by the DWP.

The Select Committee recommended they are, 'not fit for purpose' in that: around 70% do not reply and only 20% 're-pay' the purported sums owed; around half of the letters sought less than £100 in any event; and the majority of 'overpayments' are largely due to the DWP's own systems in delaying in actioning the notification of death and as such are official error.

In short, it's costing the State more to produce this bureaucracy than it recovers; but, such is life.

From memory the newish Secretary of State said a review of a dozen or so letters within the DWP estate is currently being undertaken so we should know within months (and before the Summer recess) whether they are to be ended.

If your question meant: does the DWP pursue these historic 'debts' - the answer was in fewer than 1% of estates; so it's a moral rather than a practical obligation in reality.

Any debt that is legally owed and has been proved MUST be paid prior to the winding up of the estate. The point here is that the DWP or Pension Service have to formally claim that a debt is owed. Also it is the responsibility of the Administrator/Executor that if they know or believe that a debt is owed even if no claim is made, they must contact the person/organisation to ask them to put a claim in.
All claims are then scrutinised by the Administrator/Executor as to whether they should be paid. If the Administrator/Executor fails to pay a debt that they believe is due, the debt must then be paid by the Administrator/Executor out of their own pocket.
It is not unknown for the DWP to hold up the finalisation of the estate for months if not years - they are not known for their speed in dealing with debts owed to them by an estate.

Mersey_2 · 12 January 2017 at 7:12PM

That's true in theory, but as I indicated, given most letters relate to £100 or less, this is presumably why the DWP takes no further action or holds up the admin of many estates.

TELLIT01 · 12 January 2017 at 9:06PM

rockingbilly wrote: »

It is not unknown for the DWP to hold up the finalisation of the estate for months if not years - they are not known for their speed in dealing with debts owed to them by an estate.

That would only happen if there was a large debt outstanding, not for a simple overpayment of a month's pension or similar.

cptkwoman · 13 January 2017 at 12:18AM

pmlindyloo wrote: »

You do need to telephone them.

The letter you were originally sent is often sent when someone has passed away.

They check to see whether any benefits were incorrectly paid over previous years. The last letter seems to indicate that the benefits were correctly paid.

The only other matter is whether the last payments were made after the death. This sometimes happen if the bank account wasn't frozen immediately.

Telephone and see whether there are overpayments made after the date of the death. You can also check the bank account to see if this happened.

Thanks for the advice. Some of the last payments were made after death, and some after we had informed them.

I understand now that the other letter was to check that previous benefits had been made correctly, so that is very helpful.

Thank you!

cptkwoman · 13 January 2017 at 12:27AM

Mersey wrote: »

These are standard, system-produced letters which are sent out by the DWP.

The Select Committee recommended they are, 'not fit for purpose' in that: around 70% do not reply and only 20% 're-pay' the purported sums owed; around half of the letters sought less than £100 in any event; and the majority of 'overpayments' are largely due to the DWP's own systems in delaying in actioning the notification of death and as such are official error.

In short, it's costing the State more to produce this bureaucracy than it recovers; but, such is life.

From memory the newish Secretary of State said a review of a dozen or so letters within the DWP estate is currently being undertaken so we should know within months (and before the Summer recess) whether they are to be ended.

If your question meant: does the DWP pursue these historic 'debts' - the answer was in fewer than 1% of estates; so it's a moral rather than a practical obligation in reality.

Many thanks for your comprehensive explanations. The figures coincide with what I had imagined, and are interesting to know.

As we were quick to inform them, the amounts they are requesting to be repaid are quite low. I am not the Executor, have just been helping out, so the moral question of repayment is ultimately not mine to answer. It is a fine line between "official error" and reasonable speed of action, in my opinion.

Even when recently bereaved, I would prefer to receive a letter that was written definitively rather than one that was too keen not to offend me.

DWP overpayment after death

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