Premier Park - Southampton - St Mary's Church

Muscat63 · 20 June 2016 at 9:04PM

X received a Parking Charge Notice from this company.

X drove into a parking space at 1201h..... and then paid for 3 hours parking at 1224h. The ticket expiry time was 1524h. X exited the car park at 1519h.

X did not realise that cameras recorded their arrival and departure. If X had done then X would have not entered the car park until X needed to leave the car unattended. They say the terms and conditions are clearly posted, but X didn't see any, other than those on the machine. However X can go back to check and take photos. X recalls They had to enter the registration on the ticket machine.

They say X overstayed by 17minutes. The requested payment is £100, or £60 if paid within 28 days.

Please can anyone advise what X should do? Thanks in advance.

Redx · 20 June 2016 at 9:06PM

yes, read the advice in the NEWBIES sticky thread and follow it completely, after checking which AOS the PPC is affiliated into because there are several with similar names

thorfan · 28 June 2016 at 5:44PM

As Redx says, read the newbies thread and follow it. Also search for other threads that are to do with Premier Park Limited (including this one https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5418086) as you will find that they are just as slippery as any other.

I am having lots of fun with them at the moment as a result of one of their tickets!

Muscat63 · 7 July 2016 at 4:35PM

X is just sorting this out now, as we were called away overseas for a funeral.

The PCN says "the driver became liable for a parking charge at St Mary's Church, Southampton, that we are authorised to manage on the 8th June 2016 at 15.19."

15.19 is the time X left the car park. The three hours of parking time which X purchased did not expire until 15.24 according to the ticket.

Therefore it seems that X was not in breach of their rules at 15.19, which is the time they refer to in the PCN. Either that or their number plate recognition system is not compatible with their ticket issuing system. That is to say, if X entered the car park at 12.01, when X put 3 hours worth of money into the machine, the ticket should have expired at 15.01.

Should X mention this discrepancy in their electronic systems in my appeal?

Thanks for all the help offered so far

Coupon-mad · 7 July 2016 at 5:20PM

Should I mention this discrepancy in their electronic systems in my appeal? (Writing as my husband who is the keeper of the vehicle, and not disclosing who was driving/keeping the vehicle at this time).

Yes and attach a copy of the ticket as proof that the parking time had not expired and you can say (add this somewhere in the template appeal, where ever you like):

quite reasonably, the driver relied upon the expiry time on the ticket, as you would. If you are operating to secret (unknown) different timings then this is sharp practice and was not made clear.

Muscat63 · 7 July 2016 at 5:37PM

Thanks, Coupon-mad. Unfortunately X really did not realise it was a problem to do this. If X had been on the street X would have driven away if They had seen a warden type person. It's a churchyard, and the signs with 'Parking from £1' made X think this was a friendly little money earner for the church roof, or some such.

Anyway, thank you very much for the advice which X shall follow. x also has photos of the signs, which are actually quite inadequate, especially as they are all on the passenger side of the entrance drive to the parking area.

Coupon-mad · 7 July 2016 at 5:57PM

Yes, we know people always think of parking 'wardens' on foot with a pocketbook - but cameras are everywhere. In London cameras are trained on all sorts of roads/bays for 'traffic enforcement' by local authorities, so forget the idea that you would move if asked to by a neighbourhood CEO who might be hiding round a corner or plodding up and down. It's not that simple, parked is parked.

BUT we are helping you to appeal this in a way that can win because Premier park PCNs are not compliant. That's an important issue for POPLA stage as long as you don't name the driver in the appeal, nor respond to PP's begging letter wanting to know.

the signs with 'Parking from £1' ... I also have photos of the signs, which are actually quite inadequate

Can you show us the pictures of signs? Parking from £1, with no caveat, is misleading.

If you can't post photo links yet, change the http to hxxp.

Muscat63 · 7 July 2016 at 8:23PM

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BzBN_JcUxPjcV1hxN0ZwOHBQRk0

I hope this will take you to a google drive folder of pics...

The final sign on the way in (red car in pic) is turned so you really don't notice it on the way in.

Coupon-mad · 7 July 2016 at 8:35PM

Yes they do not look adequate but there must be other signs with full terms.

Muscat63 · 7 July 2016 at 8:45PM

No, They couldn't see a sign anywhere else. X didn't take a pic of the machine itself though. When X was paying They were very much wrapped up in the whole number plate thing and checking how much to pay.

The sign that is in the pic which has the red car in it is easy to miss, because it's not on the driver side and you wouldn't be expected to read a traffic warning sign if it was orientated like that.

But X honestly thought this was a little local concern, because it says St Mary's Church on the signs. It makes it look like they are running the operation, not Premier Park.

Coupon-mad · 7 July 2016 at 8:54PM

So no terms are visible unless you approach the (not very obvious!) machine and the entrance signs just communicate 'parking from £1' and do not tell you that ANPR is there nor do they tell you how the camera images will be used to count the time of arrival, to enforce a time limit you never knew the clock had started for.

Luckily you also have the ace card of 'no keeper liability', for POPLA stage (search the forum for 'Premier Park POPLA' to find ones we did earlier)! No saying who was driving so no ad-libs.

Premier Park - Southampton - St Mary's Church

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